BIM w/ AutoCAD MEP

[ekolto]

It seems as there are so many different ways to implement BIM or define what a true BIM actually is. Has anyone succesfully created a "BIM" drawing 4D or 5D using AutoCAD and any third party software? We currently use AutoCAD MEP 2009/10, QuickPen pipe designer, and NavisWorks manage.

We've created 3D models that have information that pertains to each part such as type and supplier, along with other generic info such as elevation, size, system, etc.... We have used these for coordination on projects using Navisworks. I know I can add a schedule to the 3D model using NavisWorks, making a 4D model. ACAD MEP allows you to add any extended data that you want, is this the way to achieve a 5D model (adding cost) through MEP?

I know that there is a lot of debate over Revit vs ACAD... However as a Plumbing contractor I don't see us switching to Revit anytime soon. I'm aware that Revit allows engineering data to go along with the components and ACAD MEP does not as well as real-time collision detection.

There doesn't seem to be a whole lot of information on how to actually create a BIM drawing. Any input/help would be appreciated. Again we are a mechanical contractor, so I'm not so concerned with the archictectural aspect or strengths of Revit.

Thanks!

[RobertB]

You can absolutely use AutoCAD MEP to produce a BIM. Attach the data you need, including cost information, using the Property Set Data (PSD) feature.

AutoCAD MEP did not start life in a BIM world but that does not mean you cannot use it to produce a BIM. It models and attaches rich data. Perhaps not as seamlessly as BIM authoring software. But it still provides the "I" in BIM as long as you add the data.

[Matthew Lohden]

BIM is different things to different teams at different times. Any program that works with identifiable building components (as opposed to simple geometry) is some form of BIM. I have worked with AutoCAD MEP as well as CADduct, CADpipe, etc. at various times with various teams (Revit MEP not so much yet). They all can be made to work.

The meaning of "True BIM" depends on whether your point of view is theoretical or operational. Both are important but I am guessing that it is the operational side that you are asking about. In that case I believe that true BIM is whatever works best at the moment to get the building built properly.

You mention 4D and 5D. These are still a bit more in the theoretical arena at this point. Navis has Timeliner and Synchro is all about 4D but so far I have yet to see these put to practical use (examples would be welcome though :) ). 5D has the fundamental problem that estimators will not trust someone else's model so it mainly serves as a preliminary budgeting tool or to double check the conventional take off.

The bottom line is that if you are happy with AutoCAD MEP stick with it. It can be made to work in a BIM environment pretty much as well as any other and I don't think Autodesk is planning a forced migration to Revit any time soon. I haven't tried the clash detection in Revit but so far my experience in BIM authoring is that visual coordination works just fine (can be a problem if you are working in wireframe though). The automatic clash detection comes into play more when coordinating the various trades in Navis or such and even then it can be more trouble than it's worth some times.

I'm not an MEP guy so I'm not sure what you mean about the engineering data. Are you talking about output to fabrication or for further analysis? Does Revit have a significant advantage here?

[m20roxxers]

I think the only disadvantage is the breaking up of ACAD MEP models. They really have to be broken down into alot more separate files then Revit.

However once in Navisworks this is not an issue. If it works go for it.

[magnolouis749573]

Hi Guys,

Im just new here, and I know its a little late to reply on this topic but I think I can relate. Im an Acad MEP user and I have created some 3D MEP Models with animation walkthroughs utilizing navisworks manage. The 3D models i created were not totally data rich for they were made for presentation and coordination purposes. But still im trying to improve by adding more datas or 'I' thing in BIM. Can anyone share to me wether navisworks is capable of linking a pdf files and how this LOD (Level Of Development) can be created in AcadMEP or navisworks? I would be very thankful for any opinion. And I also find it annoying that whenever you see videos of BIM it always comes with Revit Softwares making everyone think that only Revit can do BIM which seems not so fair for AcadMEP user or any other 3D softwares. And as I know autodesk release the RevitMEp and AutocadMEP on A package called MEP suite and that is what my company is using now.

Thanks...