ECOTECT SUPPORT FOR REVIT

[jwilhelm]

I just got a response from Ecotect support indicating that they will be supporting REVIT GBXML in their next release, this is sopme really neat energy modelly software for those that havent seen it www.ecotect.com

(edit sd: fiixed the link to the ecotectsite)

[beegee]

Ecotect looks good !

Also check out Green Building Studio (www.greenbuildingstudio.com/)

[Jeffrey McGrew]

ECOTECT Also supports Radiance, for those of you out there who might have been interested in this Rendering software.

This is great news! I love ECOTECT. I wonder if it's going to support the full 3D importing of the model. I've picked throught the GBXML files, and it looks like some 3D info is in there, but I don't know if it would be enough to re-create the model in full 3D....

[jason.martin]

I've picked throught the GBXML files, and it looks like some 3D info is in there, but I don't know if it would be enough to re-create the model in full 3D....

gbXML is not meant to be a full 3D import export of the entire model. It is a "lightweight" import export of the basic model geometry. There are a number of limitations and approximations made for the model geometry that can be constructed in Revit and what gbXML will accept as a valid surface.

Some of the current behavior is documented below:
Levels
The levels in the model will be used to create building floor-to-floor heights. The placement of levels at appropriate elevations is important for the validity of the exported gbXML file. Actual floors and roofs in the model are not supported at this time. The export will create simple flat floors and ceilings from the room polygons and levels. Sloped floors and roofs are ignored for now.

Design Options
The Design option used for export is the Active Design Option.

Openings
Openings for each vertical surface will be computed from the extents of the windows, doors or openings belonging to each wall. Openings in curved walls, floors, roofs and ceilings are not supported at this time.

Material
No materials from the Revit model components are transformed into thermal and optical properties for the surface definitions in gbXML at this time. If you are using the Green Building StudioTM web service, default properties for the specified building type and location will be supplied during processing.

Phase
The Project Phase used for export is Last Phase

Postal Code
The Project Address parameter under Settings > Project Information is searched for a zip code. Any five-character sequence that is numeric and greater than 999 is considered a zip code. If several instances are found, then the last one is used. The zip code is used to define the geographic location of the building.

Spaces
Each space is currently extracted as a zone. All rooms marked with room tags are collected and processed story by story. The boundaries, walls, or room dividers surrounding the room are measured by their center lines. A planar polygon is formed by extending and trimming these boundary segments. Each boundary segment may be divided into smaller line segments as for curved walls. The resulting polygon defining a room will define the polygon of a space. The polygon is scanned for duplicated vertices and these vertices are removed if possible. There can be no more than 120 vertices in a polygon at this time.

Space Types
ASHRAE enumerated space types are not supported in the Revit model at this time. If you are using Green Building Studio web service, default space types will be supplied during processing.

Stories
All levels are sorted by elevation and processed to see if they qualify as a story. To qualify, a level needs to have room tags and boundaries. After the stories have been determined, the height for each story is set. For all stories except the top one, the height is set to the difference in elevation up to the next story. The height of the top story is set to the maximum height of the walls belonging to that level, relative to the elevation of the story.

Surfaces
The room bounding polygon will define a space’s floor and ceiling. A floor or slab surface will be created for each space, depending on which story the space belongs to. If the space belongs to the lowest story, then the surface will be a slab; otherwise it will be a floor. A ceiling or a roof surface will be created for each space, depending on the story. If the space belongs to the highest story, then the surface will be a floor; otherwise it will be a ceiling. Single surfaces that transition from an interior to an exterior, such as floor overhangs or cantilevers, are not supported at this time and will be treated as interior surfaces.

For each segment of the room boundaries, a vertical surface will be created. If the segment belongs to two rooms (boundary between two rooms), then the wall surface will be an interior wall. If the segment belongs to one room (boundary to one room), then the wall surface will be considered an exterior wall. The height of the surfaces will be set to the height of the story. All surfaces created from the room bounding elements will be extended up to next story, in order to form a solid space. A wall surface can belong to two spaces, but will only be output once in the gbXML export file.

True North and Shared Coordinates
If the model is a linked file to a host using Shared Coordinates, then all coordinates will be transformed according to the active location. The azimuth for the surfaces will be calculated according to the True North specified by the active location.

Units
If the Length Units in the Revit model are set to any English unit, then the coordinates, areas, and volumes will be specified in corresponding Feet, Square Feet, and Cubic Feet. If the Length Units in the model are set to Metric, then the coordinates, areas, and volumes will be specified in corresponding Meters (m), Square Meters and Cubic Meters.

Volume & Area
The area for the space is computed by the defining planar polygon (described previously under “Spaces”). The average height is determined for the space by calculating the vertical areas of the surrounding walls and the perimeter of the planar defining polygon. The volume for the space is then computed from the average height and the area.

hth

jason

[jfk]

Hello all.

I am glad to see that Square One will be enhancing ECOTECT to read gbXML. If anyone from Square One reads this please contact me so we can assist you with any questions you may have.

Everyone should realize, as I think some posts here have indicated, that gbXML is intended to streamline the ability to do various analyses with your building by eliminating the "take-off" step for entering geometry into another program.

gbXML contains the thermal model geometry of the building including shading surfaces. It also has elements that can contain the majority of information necessary for doing green building analyses. I encourage you all to try our Green Building Studio (http://www.greenbuildingstudio.com) web service as early as you have your building form designed in Revit 6.1 or later to get imeadiate energy use values.

Our service is applicable for buildings located in the USA, but we will be enabling it in other countries as demand requires.

[Scott Hopkins]

Along these same lines, see this latest press release from Autodesk...

http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/item?siteID=123112&id=4220792&linkID=1977925

[ita]

Ecotect V5.xx will read and load 3ds files (this can be achieved by Revit>ADT or Autocad>Vis, however most 3ds models imported are too complex for accurate modelling. My understanding is that this is an issue with many energy or emnvironment modellers. The imported models mostlt have two planes to define matertial or element thickness and so read the two surfaces as a combined thickeness - thus doubling the R value of the element when ecotect reads the model for analysis.

I find it simpler, quicker and achieve a more accurate result to sketch the model in the
Ecotect modeller. Because Ecotect is interested in the material envelope of the zone, which is represented by single planes - complex modelling is not required to achieve outstanding results.

For Oz users, Andrew Marsh is a grad from the School of Architecture at University of Western Australia, and developed Ecotect during his encumberance as a lecturer - all the daylight and weather tables for Oz towns and cities are readliy available as standard.

Personally I find Ecotect an absolutelu in valable tool. I make the most user from modelling an opening in a wall and designing the sun shade - from the rev erse analysis capabilities of the app.

[janunson]

I have version 5.2, and can't find any indications that i can import GBXML. Is this still a future feature?

Square One's site is down at the moment so i can't refer to their docs, but it sure would be great to get some good analasys tools that read right from Revit, so we can do a little less duplicate modeling...

[janunson]

Slight change on the Square 1 site - they now have a message (Whew! they're still there!) saying they'll be back soon -

http://www.squ1.com/

This site is currently closed for maintenance -- but we will be launching our new website, brand new version of ECOTECT (and our other software), as well as lots of other goodies,
very, very soon.



So please check back again shortly, when we will be back on-line with all things brand new!



(Updated January 2006)

[Joef]

I am curious why U.S. only for these products? An imaginary line drawn on a map could hardly impact environmental calculations. Just curious.


Joe

[janunson]

Ecotect is available worldwide, so is revit...

Some products that deal with specific building regulations would have to be localized, however. Often the US gets it first because of the size of the market, i think.

[janunson]

06.05.24 - Update
Square 1 site now predicts a new site and software coming in June.
http://www.squ1.com/closed.html


More new news from Square 1:


Getting back to Square One…

March 2006

To all our Square One visitors and ECOTECTers.

Firstly I’d like to apologise for Square One having been offline these last few months. We really needed to focus on our latest ECOTECT release as well as developing a new Square One web site, and we thought this would be the best way to achieve this.

Unfortunately my work at Cardiff University also ramped up substantially at exactly the same time as going offline; proposing and developing a new Masters course, running two large research projects and managing some complex consulting jobs (in addition to my regular teaching, research and admin loads). The extra work at Cardiff has been beneficial for my work at Square One in some ways; we have developed a significant amount of new training material, and consulting jobs have meant that ECOTECT has been rigorously put through its paces (in particular its interfaces with EnergyPlus, ESP-r and ASHRAE 90.1).

However, it also played havoc with the amount of time I could spend on ECOTECT and Square One.

As a result, I have since resigned from Cardiff University in order to put all my time and efforts towards the development and support of ECOTECT. This is an exciting prospect for me and I’m sure its one that will mark a new change for the better for Square One too.

We have many great plans and ideas, with a huge collection of new tools, services and support for the entire environmental building design community.

So… I would like to apologise again for the delays and inconveniences recently, and hope you will bear with us for just a little longer and revisit us here again soon when the all efforts of Square One will be revealed…

Sincerely and with great anticipation!

Dr. Andrew J. Marsh
Co-Founder and Head of R&D

[janunson]

Ecotect is Back!!

http://www.squ1.com/
5.5 is available for Beta testing.

[Andre Baros]

Great news, thanks for the update!

[janunson]

Good news and bad news - i was looking for gbxml documentation - and found a disapointing entry: This is why people clamor for a true API for Revit, and i think autodesk missed a great oportunity on this one.

From the Help file: "With the generous support of Graphisoft R&D, we are very pleased to offer complete integration with their flagship product ArchiCAD. This is achieved primarily through the ArchiCAD API, but is also possible via IFC import / export, and gbXML import / export. The implementation of IFC 2x (and gbXML) also provides for better compatibility with other analysis engines and CAD software programs, such as Microstation and AutoCAD."

[Danny Polkinhorn]

This is why people clamor for a true API for Revit, and i think autodesk missed a great oportunity on this one.What is it you're looking for? All the information you need for Ecotect to support Revit is already available in the current API. Whether Ecotect chooses to work with Autodesk is another thing.

[craines]

Hi there.

Just thought I'd my 2c worth regarding Revit support, direct from the horse :) so to speak.
We intend to support as many CAD programs as we can with ECOTECT -- now and always, so that definately includes Revit. The only reason we mentioned the support from Graphisoft in the ECOTECT documentation, is that they approached us directly and have shown great enthusiasm for our two products to work well together... including direct contact to their programmers etc. for assistance.

This kind of support from a CAD company is not necessary for us to integrate with their respective products, it just helps a lot!! ...and makes the process quicker/easier and generally a better integration is the outcome. I guess it also ensures that we move things up the priority list for feature additions.

We aim to be including the support for ArchiCAD, IFCs and gbXML (in that order if time gets tight) in the first ECOTECT v5.50 release candidate, schedule for this can be found at the following if anyone is interested:
http://squ1.com/ecotect-v550-trialbeta

I am curious why U.S. only for these products? An imaginary line drawn on a map could hardly impact environmental calculations. Just curious.
Joe
ECOTECT is definately not US only... in fact you could even say we have been slow in supporting US Standard units etc. as SI is just so common in the engineering/analysis arena. We do now have full unit localisation support in v5.50 though, including any custom options a user may want... :D happy days!

Anyway, hope this clears things up a bit... particularly in regard to our intentions for CAD integration.

Caroline Raines
Square One reseach
www.squ1.com
www.ecotect.com

[Danny Polkinhorn]

Caroline,

Thanks for the thoughtful response. I hope I didn't come across as accusatory, I just hoped to point out that the API in Revit was robust enough to serve your puposes. Hopefully your company is an ADN member, as I think you'll find the same helpful support from the Revit developers.

It would be nice to see direct support for Ecotect within Revit, and I'm encouraged by your support for IFCs.

Thanks,

[craines]

I hope I didn't come across as accusatory
No, of course not Danny :) please don't give it a second thought!
As you rightly say, I am sure the Revit API will be enough to get integration with ECOTECTsorted (although I'm no programmer).

We're not a ADN member yet, but that can be easily sorted out...

I am certain we will get round to direct Revit support, probably not in v5.50 though -- but I guess in theory its not essential (even for ArchiCAD support) if you can use IFCs... and this we will definately be including!

Best.
Caroline

[Andre Baros]

For people using Ecotect now, pre-IFC or GBxml import, how are you using it with Revit?
Do you do a design model directly in Ecotect or do you use a DXF import and assign zones in Ecotect?

For people using Green Building Studio, what does it do? what does it look like? what is the output file? Why is the web page so vague?

[janunson]

Honestly, i find it faster to rebuild the model in ecotect, breaking the building into only applicable assemblies and leaving everything else out... for this i'll export 3D and strip it down to the applicable componants, import into Ecotect and use them mostly for reference, create new zones, etc. but mostly this may be because i'm not very skilled in Ecotect yet.

This is why i've been so interested in a good interoperability path - i see great value in using revits creation tools with ecotects analysis tools.

[joshua]

For people using Green Building Studio, what does it do? what does it look like? what is the output file? Why is the web page so vague?

GBS is a great way to do energy analysis before you go hire an engineer. It allows you to check design and alter materials/assemblies for quick design comparisons. For me, it is a first line of inquiry as well as a translater, since it can turn a revit model into an energy+ model for final calculations and reports as required by the municipality.
For example, I design a small office building, and want to directly compare the energy implications of using steel stud vs concrete block vs whatever. This would take me about 10 minutes time with GBS, not to mention, since I am in NorCal, telling me how my design compares to a standard "Savings by Design" building, and the potential financial benefit that goes along with that. I can then give my client the choice with actual dollar signs, rather than a vague "you'll save money in the long run" type statement. All without ever picking up the phone and getting a consultant online. It really helps me push the sustainable design benefits with clients.

j

[Andre Baros]

Thank you very much. Is GBS just a web app, or is there something client side? Do you do anything differently in your Revit model to make it work?

[Joef]

Actually there is another feature in 9.1 that I think relates to this. You can now specify your Zip Code (if you have one, which I don't) when you export your GBxml file. Haven't got my 9.1 yet so I am going from memory here.

Joe

[joshua]

Thank you very much. Is GBS just a web app, or is there something client side? Do you do anything differently in your Revit model to make it work?

There is a client side interface where you specify project type and location before running an analysis. I am just starting to try it with the Room feature in Revit. Previously it assumed level height to be floor to floor, resulting in some inaccuracy. Hopefully the room feature will help get better data from rooms with varying ceiling heights.

I haven't tried the zip code feature mentioned above.

I am attaching a tutorial from GBS that really goes into detail on how to use it with Revit.

j