2010 Conceptual Massing Tools

[Dimitri Harvalias]

Just wondering, of those 'actively' using these tools, what are your opinions and comments? Not fishing for good or bad, just your version of the truth.

If you find them useful say so and if you find they have shortcomings articulate them (don't turn it into another Autodesk bashing thread please )

[zilla_g]

hi there!

Im an architecture student and i dont think anyone could say they are not worth using. I'm still playing with the new tools, and trying to figure out its limits [ ] but i must admit i've found the 2009 massing to be easier to edit and maintain as simple 2d extrusions.

But the new tools ARE pretty fantastical. Dragging edges has become a favourite of mine (particularly useful if you have a site Height Limit and the contours are really funky- add edges to the extrusion, then drag them vertically to meet the toposurface and voila !

The X-ray function in massing is also pretty interesting. I made a form by marking the path, placing a reference point and then drawing the cross-section and extruding, and then by activating xray i could edit the path nodes. In doing this i can now make a snake like form that can meander up my contours even- which was certainly difficult in the previous 2009. Actually if anyone knows, can you please tell me, is it possible to extend the "path" after the form has been created?

Back to topic, one thingi do find iritating is the somewhat confusing control that dimensions in 3d automatically apply the new massing. It is also a bit of a pain to dimension things such as elevation differences as well, due the lack of a fixed working plane. If they had elevation properties, for reference points, edges that were orthoganally related, it would be very much easier for manipulating, (rather than having to go through and place dimensions aligned to reference planes).

Overall my opinion is that they're useful. A little (if not VERY) messy to play with (i resorted to a pasticine model out of a little frustration, because it was difficult to quickly re-created what was in my mind's eye for the design - can you believe, i finally out of my own will resorted to that! I blame the lecturers encouraging it over the last 4 years!) Anyway the plasticine model worked. Now i have to get it into revit. Given my deadline doesnt consume me, which it likely will, i will try and post some images of the end result.

Oh and can i just say, as a student, who loves shortcut keys, sporadic clicking, and computers that run really fast, the new Design Bar is bloody disorientating! Fantastic. But incredibly disorientating. The idea is right. But how could they get it so wrong.. The fact that when run on most computers, the millisecond pause between revit calculating what is "context" appropriate for the current object/view/task will give any fast paced 2009 user the absolute s***s waiting for the new 2010 design bar to load up..

Anyway enough of my ranting - i hope this helps. If anyone can assist me with the extrusion path question above, i would be extremely grateful!

Use the massing tool. They're groovy! and can make client drooling renders ;P
[if you dont like it though, dont worry you can always resort to plasticine ]

[Wes Macaulay]

Hey Dimitri

We use the massing tools a fair amount to do raked/angled walls and other quirky forms. The new massing tools offer a lot of new functionality, but having to use Reference Lines for everything is a drag -- they're visually intrusive. If you have a significant in-place massing form, you'll have a whack of reference lines all over the place.

Plus, you cannot change one sketch line at the end of a form from an arc to a line without completely recreating the form! That's really bad... so the 2010 massing tools are a major step backwards for us.

[sbrown]

One of the most powerful tools is the addition of Ref. Points. You can place these points anywhere in space, dimension them, label them and control geometry with them. IE spline thru points, then add a profile and you can make waterslides, roller coasters, even a snake with scales if you want(I know I tried ) There is tremendous power in these tools. unfortunately they are purely "conceptual" and in the current state you can not easily if at all translate these creations into constructable models due to a few limitations. Unless your willing to accept what the tools give you by default on placement of surface divisions etc. you will get stuck very quickly if you need to "fine tune" the design.

Also, not being about to edit the base sketch is awful for simple geometry. Some how they must bring that ability back. Now you can dimension the base geometry and label it so you can control it, just not say change straight lines to arcs and finish sketch like you could in 2009 and earlier. All in all I think these are the beginings of some tremendous tools.