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Thread: Phases & Room Tags

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    Default Phases & Room Tags

    I have a demolition plan and a renovation plan. We are knocking out some interior walls at one end of the gym in order to add a cafe and classrooms adjacent to the church lobby. How should I approach placing room tags so that the existing room tags show on both plans while the new room tags only show on the new plan?

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    Cool Re: Phases & Room Tags

    Place the existing rooms in the Existing Phase, then tag them.

    Likewise, place the new rooms in the New Construction Phase, then tag.

    You can then filter the view to show the different phases as required.

    does this help?

    cheers......

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    Revit Mararishi aaronrumple's Avatar
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    Default Re: Phases & Room Tags

    This is one of those things that is screwed up in Revit. (...but demo's well for a reseller.)

    If you have a demo plan, you should be using a view set to New Construction with a phase filter of Show Previous + Demo. Items that are demo'ed are demo'ed in the new phase. This is the classic way Revit is supposed to work (before we get to the work arounds).

    Unfortunately, this creates some issues. Demo'ed walls are not room bounding. So placed rooms bleed out into other areas and you can't do calcs. Also there is a conflict then with new rooms. Since the demo is being done in the new phase, the rooms then show up in the new construction phase as you are using a view setting of New Construction and a phase filter of Show Previous + New. Rooms exist only at one point in time unlike other Revit objects.

    Now if you add a Demo phase in between the existing and new, you can get the new plan to work ok since you would draw your as-built in the existing phase. Demo objects in the Demo phase and show the new objects in the new phase.

    Existing is set to Existing + Show All
    Demo is set to Demo + Show Previous and Demo
    New is set to New + Show Previous and New.

    However, if you tag the rooms in demo, they will still have the issue of demo'ed walls not being room bounding. A work-around for this (although a management nightmare) is to add room separation lines in the demo phase on top of the walls to split the phases. The the room separation lines will have to be demo'ed in the new phase. You can see how this get's messy.

    Or you just let the rooms overlap and screw the area calcs on existing spaces.

    Another option is to use the temporary object status for demo. In this scenario, you would set you demo view to Existing and demo any items in that same phase. Now you'll need to adjust your phase filter graphic overrides accordingly. After this you'll still have the issue of temporary walls not being room dividing. So you can revert back to the trick above and place room separation lines and then demo them in the new phase. Whew.

    Or you can do what we do. Just place dumb fake room tags in demo. Group them so you can place them in multiple views and update all views at once. And be done with it.

    The whole thing needs a re-think by the development team. I'd suggest that demo'ed walls be room bounding. The temporary walls would have a toggle to be either room bounding or not. Another way that might fix the problem is to have phasing that could look ahead rather than just back. Then you could have an existing view looking ahead to the demo phase. Maybe there is a better way.

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    Default Re: Phases & Room Tags

    Quote Originally Posted by aaronrumple View Post
    Another way that might fix the problem is to have phasing that could look ahead rather than just back. Then you could have an existing view looking ahead to the demo phase. Maybe there is a better way.
    Yes, this would be great, show future and demo.

    We use text, which really isn't that bad except that we usually have already tagged the existing rooms, so the text is obviously a redundant step.

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    Active Member hermeytheelf's Avatar
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    Default Re: Phases & Room Tags

    Another way to do it, and retain the intended phase and phase filter settings, is to handle it on the sheet. Even pre-2011, plans that are stacked on top of eachother on a sheet will align to common datums like structural grids. To get the room tags in your existing rooms to show up in a new construction or demo view that is on a sheet just place the existing plan view that has the existing rooms in it on the sheet too. You can have that views visibibility graphics set in a way that most of the other stuff is turned off. Sort of a poor mans underlay.

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    Default Re: Phases & Room Tags

    Thanks Aaron for the overview of the options to solve this dilemma that everyone has when handling most projects that involve an existing structure.

    I have worked out many of what you covered. I also tried redundant rooms and then used the area field as a filter. This would remove them from any schedule and their calculations. The problem is that you are creating false data to avoid a simple manual process. You then have to "manage" your fake data as well - schedules, LEED export files, etc. Something is bound to get screwed up.

    I have also come to the conclusion that you make a dummy room tag and be done with it. All this work around and faking it on so many other fronts. Most cases, it will require minimal work and management.

    If it is a major change in rooms, then i would use Hermey's idea of the poor mans underlay - create an exisitng plan of just the room tags - place that under your demo plan and be done. This would handle any management issues as well.

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