Adpoting NCS Standards

[drigarlsford]

Fellow Cad'ers,

I have been searching endlessly to no avail, for an explanation or input regarding the NCS Standards.

We are a mid-sized manufacturing company with prehistoric standards, sorely in need or upgrades. As an example, a block was created using three layers - medium, light and hatch - medium being the layer used for primary/major lines - light being the layer used for secondary/minor lines and hatch being the layer used for hatches. Our dimensions are on a dimension layer. All blocks are inserted on the 0 layer. I know, breathe slowly.

That being said, there will be a difficult transition to any other standards system.

My question is: Given the bandwagon jumping towards the NCS standards and the obvious agony for us to jump on board, is it worth it?

Keep in mind that the tools used for construction of our blocks (cosmetic appearance: linetypes, colors, hatches and attributes) do not have specific NCS layers allocated for their construction. Not very difficult to figure out, I agree. But, it would require a complete set of drawing templates for the various drawings - Floor Plans, Elevations and Details due to the specific layering. Yet there is no specific information as to what layers are to be used for example, in our detail drawings vis a vis construction.

So, instead of a "hop" for our design team to adjust to, it would become a full "hop, skip and a jump".

Did I mention there is a conflict between design team and management regarding the need for change?

As well, we are branching into Revit and from what I've seen, this is a catalyst for the NCS jump.

Any information would be greatly appreciated.

David

[cadtag]

so, is management pushing _for_ a change, or against it?

second question - do you share dwg files with other entities - clients, subs, partners, etc?

[tedg]

I noticed you mentioned that you are a manufacturing company, yet you create floor plans? What do you manufacture?

If you're creating drawings for building design and construction, I agree you should go to NCS (my opinion).

Yes, when you export a REVIT drawing, the layers are in NCS (AIA) format, sometimes not pretty though.

As far as what layers to use for what, NCS is a guidline with a little wiggle room as long as you stay within the rules and approved lists.

There are layer guidlines for plan work, sections, elevations, detailing etc for all discipines.

NCS doesn't have allot of options for "detailing" with line weights ByLayer. We've worked around that with "user defined" sections in the layer naming for line weights.

We use line weights such as .07mm, 0.5mm, 0.35mm, 0.25mm, 0.18mm etc. So we have added user defined fields in our detail layers which is allowed in NCS.

For example, I working in structural design, so most,if not all of my detailing is structural related, so my detail layers start with an "S" for the structural discipline are look like:
S-DETL-0050 (4 digit, user defined, line weight = 0.50mm)
S-DETL-0035
S-DETL-0025
S-DETL-0018
S-DETL-HDLN (hidden line)
S-DETL-HDLN-0035 (hidden line with a specific line weight)
S-DETL-PATT
S-DETL-CNTR (center line)

and of course we have:
S-ANNO-DIMS
S-ANNO-TEXT

All these layers are to be used ByLayer, and they have colors and line weights assigned to them so they can be used in many cad standards and plot styles for color or object/layer line wight.
Changing the color or line weight of an entitiy to other than ByLayer is frowned upon, especially if others are sharing your work through xrefs, etc.

Hope this helps

[drigarlsford]

1. Quasi-pushing - they know something has to be developed for the coming Revit storm but they don't know how deep they want to go. Also, they start shaking when told the time it would take to develop the standards. I've tried the "save you time and money" route but seem to be speaking another language. Foresight is not our strong suit.

2. Yes, sometimes they are requested by clients. Our partners usually supply their dwg's to us for our format.

As mentioned, we will need to follow the NCS for Revit - unless there are standards designed specifically for Revit.

[drigarlsford]

Ted,

We manufacture laboratory furniture systems and fume hoods. 99% of tour clients require presentation drawing sets.

Thank you for the insight - reading through the NCS does give some guidance for contractor/shop drawings but I wanted real world advice. Which you kindly and generously provided.

I'd rather ask questions and gauge the usefulness. If the foundation is solid...as they say.

[SoCal CAD Guru]

My work is governed by client standards (typically DOT's) 99% of the time. But my company is making a shift towards NCS for their other disciplines. One of the touted advantages is the ability to have someone else maintain the standards library so your company will not have to have someone babysit your standards on overhead.

If you have nothing, it is a good place to start. If you are just looking for layer control, you may be able to get away with creating your own based upon NCS's formula and strongly pushing the use of templates. The hardest part is getting your users in the habit of using the new system.

[drigarlsford]

RJ,

Unfortunately, one of our problems is exactly that - babysitting our libraries. You wouldn't believe the amount of deleted files and additions.

I haven't given up hope yet...

Thanks for your response.
David

[Mitch Mermel]

I am the CAD manager of a consulting engineering firm. About five years ago I was given the green light to attempt a change-over to the NCS.
I implemented the NCS layer naming strategy - that part worked well.
I implemented their symbols - but they never had enough to cover all that we required, and some the boss just didn't like. I went back to using our old symbols.
I tried implementing their pen table (this was NCS 3.0) It didn't really provide enough colors at the right pen weights for our use. My current pen table is based on the NCS/AIA pen table. Currently, the NCS recommends pen lineweight by object or layer, not the customary ACAD color based lineweight. I don't know if we'll ever make that changeover.

We do use Revit. It does not mesh as smoothly with Acad as I would like, especially where text is concerned. And as for exporting Revit to CAD, you can create your own Export Layer List (I just went through that).

We threw out parts of the NCS, we kept parts of the NCS. The problem with standards is that one size does not fit all.