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Thread: CTB vs STB

  1. #11
    Super Moderator dkoch's Avatar
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    Default Re: CTB vs STB

    Quote Originally Posted by Joe_Isuzu View Post
    I want to thank each of your for your comments and suggestions. I get that their is no clear cut winner or loser in this debate. What I was trying to is determine which everyone prefers and I see merit in both. I think this needs to be added to our on-boarding process. So we can find out if new hires are used to the ctb format and need to be trained on using our stb.

    One last question if I may. If we can get them to lock the template will the stb get locked as well? Is locking the stb even an option?
    If everyone starts from that template file, then they will all start with a file that uses STBs. But that file is one use of the CONVERTPSTYLES command from being a file that uses CTBs.

    For what it is worth, anything you can do with a CTB you can do with an STB (and vice versa); the settings for a plot style are the same for both. The difference is whether the plot style is assigned based on object color or by a direct assignment of a plot style, independent of color. My firm uses, and I prefer, STBs.

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    Default Re: CTB vs STB

    Quote Originally Posted by Joe_Isuzu View Post
    One last question if I may. If we can get them to lock the template will the stb get locked as well? Is locking the stb even an option?
    AutoCAD is to customizable to force any standards on users, having user meetings, explaining the need for CAD Standards, sharing them, and making threats are all the ammo you have.

    You can set PSTYLEPOLICY and DEFPLSTYLE to whatever you like in acaddoc.lsp, but like office templates there's always going to be a way around them.

    Talking with others about the custom STB's would be the best way to reach an agreement. Could be a need for a Plot Style that isn't included with the company STB they've grown fond of. That "5% Color" in the FDOT.stb is one that makes my hatchings more impressive. Adding Plot Styles to the company STB doesn't affect any that were already in there, no reason it shouldn't fit everyone's needs.

  3. #13
    Super Moderator CAtDiva's Avatar
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    Default Re: CTB vs STB

    I suppose I shouldn't be surprised there are so many advocates for STB here ... if I dug through my memory, it's likely conversations like this are the reason I pushed my former company to make the change. Once we did it, there wasn't much discussion.

    Unfortunately, I work for a different company now. The only reason I'm not pushing to change them to STBs is my energy is better spent advocating and developing Revit standards/families than converting their ACA/D settings.

  4. #14
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    Default Re: CTB vs STB

    We went for STB back when we changed to the 2014 version. We have a common file on a section of the network set to read only, which all the PC's and templates are configured to work with.
    It took a while for staff to come round to not using their own versions, but having all the titleboxes, blocks etc. all using the default plot styles has pulled folk in.

  5. #15
    The Silent Type RobertB's Avatar
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    Default Re: CTB vs STB

    Quote Originally Posted by dkoch View Post
    For what it is worth, anything you can do with a CTB you can do with an STB (and vice versa); the settings for a plot style are the same for both.
    That's not entirely true. I can do some pretty tricky plotting with inserts and STBs that cannot be replicated with CTBs. I did an example years ago to prove to Shaan Hurley that STBs were superior. I wonder if I have that example somewhere still...
    R. Robert Bell
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    Opinions expressed are mine alone and do not reflect the views of Stantec.

  6. #16
    Certifiable AUGI Addict ccowgill's Avatar
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    Default Re: CTB vs STB

    We used CTB up until 2014 as well, and were fully switched when we installed 2015 on everyone's machine. The primary reason for going STB was it gave us more control with our onscreen product. Although no one outside the company sees it, it gives us the ability to utilize colors that make more sense on screen, and can have the same color take on multiple properties when plotting. We only utilize the shading portion for our STB, all of your lineweights and other properties are controlled by the actual layer, which can be done with CTB as well.

  7. #17
    Administrator BlackBox's Avatar
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    Default Re: CTB vs STB

    Those who continue with CTB might want to consider this; it's the best CTB configuration I've seen to-date:

    http://forums.augi.com/showthread.ph...=1#post1280678



    Separately, as an inside joke - a belated welcome to the dark side, @RobertB... We've got [MEDAD] cookies.

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    Default Re: CTB vs STB

    My role is to implement CAD standards through our AutoCAD customisation here in Queensland Transport and Main Roads (TMR).

    About 11 to 12 years ago I switched to STB for many of the reasons mentioned above.

    We have multiple disciplines (road design, landscaping, electrical, surveying, environmental), with lots of layers to hold lots of features. There is a limited colour palette that is sensible for on-screen presentation as a minimum.

    Given that multiple features might have to be in colour green, but require different output lineweights (and maybe even different plot colours) there is a limited number of distinguishable greens to choose from when using a CTB for mapping to plotted output.

    STBs mean that we can set up a simple list of styles (Black_025, Black_050, Green_035, etc) and simply assign them to layers. The naming of the styles also makes it very clear what the output will be, where CTB requires knowledge of how the CTB is configured.

    We have a specific style for dimensions as the linework is drawn in colour 7 (white/black) which we want as 0.25mm line work, while the text is in yellow which we want to appear as 0.35mm line work.

    It all works very well within our complex disciplinary environment. If your drafting requirements are really simple then maybe CTB will work. Mind you having the layer or (gasp) object clearly marked with how it is to be output has massive advantages.

    The only thing I'm really disappointed in is that tables pay no heed to STBs, providing no mechanism for assigning plot styles to linework or text content.

    Our work around is that I've written some code to explode the table into its components, placing each piece on appropriate layers. After copying the source table of.

    All up, STBs are the best answer for tackling a complex, multi-disciplinary drafting environment.

  9. #19
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    Default Re: CTB vs STB

    I haven't used CTB in so long, I don't remember exactly what it can do and can't do. I switched years ago to STB because of its flexibility and ease of use. I have occasions when I want to temporarily change the way certain layers or objects plot. It could be for presentations or it could be for checking complex designs. Sometimes I want to change individual objects on a layer and not the other objects on the same layer. Sometimes I want to plot some objects in color, but toned down. Sometimes I want to plot certain objects or whole layers in red or yellow without changing the object color or layer color. This is especially useful for getting objects to stand out when there is a aerial photo behind the objects. In the next viewport, I turn off the aerial photo and then want those same objects to plot in black. I have over a hundred blocks for representing street signs. The background color of the street signs matches the MUTCD colors. They look good on the screen and make for a good visual check for accuracy of design. However, I do not want to plot the background colors, only the text and the outline of the sign. I don't think CTB can do that easily if at all. For me, STB plotting is consistent with the way lineweights and linetypes are assigned and used, making the STB easy to use and learn. CTB reminds me too much of the old pen plotters - you have to know which pen is in which slot of the carousel and then hope the ink hasn't dried out. For me, that is only a slight exaggeration - I don't want to ever go back to CTB plotting.

  10. #20
    Certifiable AUGI Addict ccowgill's Avatar
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    Default Re: CTB vs STB

    Quote Originally Posted by brendan.j.mallon View Post
    ...
    The only thing I'm really disappointed in is that tables pay no heed to STBs, providing no mechanism for assigning plot styles to linework or text content.

    Our work around is that I've written some code to explode the table into its components, placing each piece on appropriate layers. After copying the source table of.

    All up, STBs are the best answer for tackling a complex, multi-disciplinary drafting environment.
    We use the individual layers for lineweights, what I've been doing is just assigning the required lineweights to the grid, this is only a downside if we need transparency, as I dont think that is an option.

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