Can it do this? Construction Assembly/Framing Modeling/Display

[jkrager]

I was perusing through the sketchup site the other day and found this very descriptive picture. I thought, Revit should be able to do something like that, as well as calculate/schedule the number of 4x8 sheets needed to cover the walls and floors. Has anyone done such a thing, and created views of it? Please post them here. If not, is anyone up to the challenge? Also, if you are willing to share your families or techniques...please?

[mlgatzke]

. . . I thought, Revit should be able to do something like that, as well as calculate/schedule the number of 4x8 sheets needed to cover the walls and floors. Has anyone done such a thing, and created views of it?

I believe the more important question is, "Why"? See the following thread:
http://forums.augi.com/showthread.php?t=28281

[sjsl]

Why, exactly. I have been doing residential for over 20 yrs. and have never once been asked by any contractor to do this. Why would any architect or home designer put themselves at such risk when the GC is clearly the lead? If you are in production housing plant I can see the need, but that's so specialized an operation.

I would rather have the topo tools fixed then to have this capability right now.

[kpaxton]

Why, exactly. I have been doing residential for over 20 yrs. and have never once been asked by any contractor to do this. Why would any architect or home designer put themselves at such risk when the GC is clearly the lead? If you are in production housing plant I can see the need, but that's so specialized an operation.

I would rather have the topo tools fixed then to have this capability right now.

EXACTLY !!! WHYYYYYYYYYYY??????

I could make a pretty picture like this, but it's not going to hlep the GC in the field. Remember the old addage -
The Architect designs and draws... the Contractor builds and fixes the flaws...

The GC's will, no matter how well you detail something, inevitably change something to the way they build it.. and what they're used to doing. This isn't a slam on them, but a fact of life and the methods they use. By the way... I'm ALL for doing descriptive detailing to help the guys in the field put things together - I just don't feel I need to do this on standard things that they ought to know how to do as a basic part of their job.

Would it be nice to have the program be able to do this to help and schedule? Maybe. But as SJSL says, why would we want to open up ourselves to that liability? Everyone has their part to do in the creation of a built form - The City, the Developer, the Architect, the Contractor, the Banker ; Would you also want to take on the Fiscal responsibility of the Banker or the Developer?

If they want this functionality... Find a copy of Chief Architect at their local Best Buy. Besides, the last time I looked, SketchUp isn't a materials take off program either.

Kyle

[rsharp]

Before I got into architecture, I worked as a Carpenter for some 25 years. I would say that a framing plan like this would be helpful for take-offs, but more than likely the guys in the field wouldn't find a framing plan that detailed all that useful.

If structural drawings exist for the building the framer would generally want to use them as a guide. If structural drawings have not been prepared for the building a general framing plan that reads similarly to a structural set would be what most framers would be looking for.

The last thing a guy in the field wants is some rigid set of drawings that try to direct him on such things as where to start his layout etc.

Pre-fab construction I suppose would be an exception.

I have a feeling that the Revit developers probably have this wish list item somewhat low on their list.

[cadkiller]

Why because it's a building information model and should have this information for estimating and construction purposes. What good is BIM if you can't extract quantities of all the material for a project?

Just because you haven't done something in twenty years doesn't mean that you shouldn't do it now. You've never modeled a building before, so why do it now? Times are changing and with this new BIM technology, you can provide this valuable information for your clients and the team that will build it.

[iru69]

Why because it's a building information model and should have this information for estimating and construction purposes.

I think I agree with this line of reasoning. While it wouldn't be particularly useful for my own work, and I there are a *ton* more pressing issues/features in Revit that need addressing, I don't think it's necessarily in our interest to dismiss how Revit could potentially be used by design+build firms, contractors or for manufacturing.

Developing Revit into an application that has a broader user base than just architects means more sales for Autodesk which potentially means more development emphasis from Autodesk. Even if the "framing" is used simply for material take-offs or design and conceptual purposes (rather than CDs) could prove rather useful as Revit develops.

Just something to think about before we use the "liability" word every time a new feature is proposed that isn't currently included in typical architectural services.

[Thomas Cummings]

"The last thing a guy in the field wants is some rigid set of drawings that try to direct him on such things as where to start his layout etc."

Which is why floor joists wind up directly under toilets.

The reason GC's who use Revit in design/build need these framing diagrams is that the days of the old master career carpenter are gone. Framing crews are typically made up of someone who says he framed thousands of homes in another state and some strongbacks. The only way to get stacked framing that flows for duct work and plumbing is to have a pretty picture.

I suppose that I am in the minority as far as needing this capability but now you know why we want it

[Scott Davis]

Which is why floor joists wind up directly under toilets.

And thats why contractors who dont know how to frame end up repairing their own erros on their dollar.

I think quantity takes offs can be a calculated value, rather than actually having to model every stud. If a wall is 10'-0' long and 8'-0" tall, I'm sure a formula could be used to estimate the board-feet of lumber with waste it would take to frame the wall.

I'm all for the "model" containing as much info as possible, but unitl we get fully into 64 bit computing and terrabytes of RAM, I don't think it's practical. Somewhere down the road, yes. But for now, I think there are more important things for the developers to do with Revit.

[Steve_Stafford]

The question was, "Can Revit do this?" The answer is yes. The replies ask "why" do it and some explain why they would. While the answer to the question is yes the means and methods to do it are not designed to make it quick or effortless.

So the question "why" rears its head to demand a reason compelling enough to justify the effort. So does "why" justify the "doing" for "you"?