Setup for a large project in Navigator-Need Advice

[bbacker]

I thought I better come and ask for advice before I spend anymore time spinning my wheels on this.

Here is my situation:

We have a large multi-building project (7 buildings) on one site that will be done in ADT. I am trying to decide whether it is better to set it up as one BIG project or 7 separate projects. All the buildings are going to be submitted in the same construction document package.

I have started setting it up as one BIG project in PN. Each building has its own division and level. I broke up the site like you would break up a building. The constructs are broken down into a category per building. Element categories will be shared between the buildings. The Views will also be broken down per building. My intent was to consolidate and not repeat information. But this structure seems to be become huge and unwieldy.

I am also concerned about our sheet numbering scheme. I am leaning towards having building designators in the user defined portion of the NCS sheet numbering system. I would still maintain the NCS sequencing, however.

I can see you all going "HUH?!??!" Yes, me too.

Let me make this easy on all of us.

Have you ever worked on a multi-building project in ADT and how did you set it up?

This is the first project I have ever set up in ADT and it is a doozie. Pardon my lack of fluency in ADT speak.

Thanks for ANY help!

[Chuckyd67]

The project navigator was set up for projects like yours, with its divisions and levels. However, logistically, it seems that separate projects would be viable with seven buildings. Things to consider are, will each building have its own team of designers? Can common elements be shared via tool palettes? Will the project size slow down access to files?

If you set it up as one project, how do you organize the files for quick and easy retrieval? If it were me, I would gamble on the one-project approach, just to test the limits of the product. I would probably organize all the folders and files by building so that users do not have to drill down through so many drawings to find what they need.

Whatever you do, PLEASE keep us informed of your methods and recommendations!

[david_peterson]

I had a project somewhat similar to yours. We had 2 additions (both vary large) to 2 different existing buildings on the same site. We set things up in PN as 1 project and used letter designators in the sheets for the 2 different buildings. Of course we all needed letters designators in the views, and the elements and the constructs so we could stay with our typical company file naming conventions. While I'm sure PN could do this I'm sure there's a better way. Here's what I'm thinking.

If you are going to submit 1 set of drawings for all buildings and are setting this up as 1 campus master plan, then I could see where you might want to keep it as one project. If you are going to submit 1 campus master plan as nothing more than a basic overall site plan; along with 1 package (set) for each building; I'd take a different approach. I'd have one project that was the campus master plan. In this project I think I'd x-ref each composite model from each of the 7 buildings that make up the campus along with any other landscape or existing stuff. Then I'd do each building in it's own project. This will help cut down on some of the confusion.
Now on the other hand, this may increase some of you detailing efforts because I'm guessing that all the buildings will have some similar details. But on the other hand, if you are going to separate each building into it's own set, you'll need to have your typ details in each set anyway.
I think it really comes down to how you are going to make your deliverables. Separate, or together. I'm thinking here you want separate because the guys working on building "A" don't care about b-g. The other thing to worry about if you do one project, what happens if PN gets corrupt? Also if you have 7 building and say 30 sheets per building, that's 210 sheets you need to keep track off in the same sheet set, and who knows how many different views. I can see 1 Project for 7 buildings getting real ugly real fast.
Anyway, that's my 2 cents.

[jimmy.bergmark]

You might get into performance issues with a large project like this. It often in relation to the total number of files handled by PN.

[bbacker]

The project navigator was set up for projects like yours, with its divisions and levels. However, logistically, it seems that separate projects would be viable with seven buildings. Things to consider are, will each building have its own team of designers? Can common elements be shared via tool palettes? Will the project size slow down access to files?

If you set it up as one project, how do you organize the files for quick and easy retrieval? If it were me, I would gamble on the one-project approach, just to test the limits of the product. I would probably organize all the folders and files by building so that users do not have to drill down through so many drawings to find what they need.

Whatever you do, PLEASE keep us informed of your methods and recommendations!

I will keep you informed on how things go, don't worry about that. You may have to listening to alot of venting. This really is a first for me so it will probably be a "how not too" lesson from me. But either way I will let you know.

Brace yourselves, right now, I am the only drafter/Cad person on this job. Fun, fun, fun. I want to set this project(s) up as simply as possible so when someone new starts working on this project it won't be an unbearable task to negotiate PN.

If you can think of anything else I need to consider please don't hesitate to post or even email me.

Thanks!

[bbacker]

If you are going to submit 1 set of drawings for all buildings and are setting this up as 1 campus master plan, then I could see where you might want to keep it as one project. If you are going to submit 1 campus master plan as nothing more than a basic overall site plan; along with 1 package (set) for each building; I'd take a different approach. I'd have one project that was the campus master plan. In this project I think I'd x-ref each composite model from each of the 7 buildings that make up the campus along with any other landscape or existing stuff. Then I'd do each building in it's own project. This will help cut down on some of the confusion.

This is going to be one whole package for the site and all 7 buildings. Full construction documentation. However, I understand what are saying about the site and I was thinking along those lines as well. Having the site as a separate PN project and x-refing in the building outlines.

Now on the other hand, this may increase some of you detailing efforts because I'm guessing that all the buildings will have some similar details. But on the other hand, if you are going to separate each building into it's own set, you'll need to have your typ details in each set anyway.

Yes, all these building are going to have very similar conditions. And I would really prefer not detailing something twice. I am sure there is a way to save views into other projects though... There has to be a way.

I think it really comes down to how you are going to make your deliverables. Separate, or together. I'm thinking here you want separate because the guys working on building "A" don't care about b-g. The other thing to worry about if you do one project, what happens if PN gets corrupt? Also if you have 7 building and say 30 sheets per building, that's 210 sheets you need to keep track off in the same sheet set, and who knows how many different views. I can see 1 Project for 7 buildings getting real ugly real fast.

I totally agree. I see this as turning into a nightmare. That is why I am trying to get this laid out in some logical way before we even start this project. If it doesn't get set up right at the beginning it is going to be a big mess. Unfortunately, the client wants all the buildings submitted in one package. I am wondering, though, if we could do, mini-packages in one set.

There is actually an 8th building that is being submitted as part of the package but will be a separate drawing set because it is located on a different site.

I have going to have another heart to heart with my PM and PA about this. I know in the end, the contractor will end up breaking up the set and organizing them by building anyways.

Anyway, that's my 2 cents.

I appreciate even 1 cent! Thanks!!

[bbacker]

You might get into performance issues with a large project like this. It often in relation to the total number of files handled by PN.

Well this project will certainly test PNs limits. I know there is a limit to how deep a category structure can go. Isn't it 10 categories deep? What about the number of files?

[david_peterson]

I would try to separate them as much as possible. As far as copying views; 1 view can't exist on 2 different sheets. But you can create you "new" view and just copy and paste, or if you wanted to get really slick you could just xref in the other view. But that may cause you some heart burn. I guess if it were up to me, I'd look at it from a sheet stand point. I don't know the size or scope of your project but once you get over 100 sheets, PN starts to become almost a little counter productive, and can be down right confusing for anyone that hasn't been on the project and or isn't used to working with PN. I'm a big fan of the KISS philosophy. Keep It Stupid Simple. The more complex something is, the it can get screwed up.
Good luck.

[bbacker]

I would try to separate them as much as possible. As far as copying views; 1 view can't exist on 2 different sheets. But you can create you "new" view and just copy and paste, or if you wanted to get really slick you could just xref in the other view. But that may cause you some heart burn. I guess if it were up to me, I'd look at it from a sheet stand point. I don't know the size or scope of your project but once you get over 100 sheets, PN starts to become almost a little counter productive, and can be down right confusing for anyone that hasn't been on the project and or isn't used to working with PN. I'm a big fan of the KISS philosophy. Keep It Stupid Simple. The more complex something is, the it can get screwed up.
Good luck.

KISS...Here, here! We will definitely be over a hundred sheets.

I will experiment with new views and copy/pasting.

Thanks!