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Thread: Subscription & shelfware

  1. #1
    Certifiable AUGI Addict cadtag's Avatar
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    Default Subscription & shelfware

    Greetings,

    I'm looking for information on how Autodesk subscription software is deployed in organizations of various sizes, and how long it typically is shelfware before being deployed. For example, the 2008 product line was shipped last year, but how many of those subscription seats are not in use today, and what was the typical length of time between release and deployment for those managers who have deployed 2008? Version skipping under subscription is of interest too.

    For example:

    With a previous employer, (on the order of 300 licenses) we moved to the subscription (VIP program) with R12, received pallettes of R13 product, but did not deploy R13 at all, and did not deploy R14 until post y2k. v2000 & 2000i were shelfware, and AutoCAD 2002 was not deployed until v2004 was almost ready for release. v2004 and 2005 stayed on the shelf until 2006 was released, and then v2005 was deployed.

    With the current employer, approximately 80 licenses under subscription, 2002 was in place as of Feb '05, and the 2006 product line was not deployed until Nov '06. v2007 stayed shelfware, and 2008 is still shelfware.

    What's your experience in your organizations? How many seats on subscription, and how long a shelf life?

    cheers,
    Real pirates wear silk suits & ties, and write EULAs
    The only thing more dangerous to the liberty of a free people than big government, is big business.

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  2. #2
    100 Club jonathanschade's Avatar
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    Default Re: Subscription & shelfware

    I am supervising close to 90 licenses. Half are on subscription, the other half I am trying to bring under subscription during the first quarter of 2008.

    Our office is currently running 2006. I am the only one running 2008, testing it before I deploy it once we are all up to date.

    I have convinced the owners that it is cheeper to keep everythihng up to date with the subscription service. When I got here they had various copies of 2000i, 2005 and 2006 all running in conjunction with each other. Needles to say there was quite a mess.

    It is not unusual to have newer software available but not installed. You actually can own a copy of 2008 and install it as 2006.

    If you have more questions, or just want to talk, let me know
    Jonathan R. Schade
    CADD Manager
    Seattle, WA

  3. #3
    Forum Manager, Administrator Ed Jobe's Avatar
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    Default Re: Subscription & shelfware

    Rather than the amount of time that the software sits on the shelf, I think that the variables that cause it to sit on the shelf are more important. They can vary widely from comany to company. Sometimes its just manpower and workload that determine when it gets installed. You can be so busy that you don't have time to make the change. Here it is often schedule/workload conflicts between departments e.g. the IT dept is too busy. Another dept is always hesitant to upgrade because it consists mainly of users that don't use acad very often and are intolerant of any change. They feel that upgrading is counter-productive. However, there is significant proof here that falling too far behind produces a training lag that's hard to overcome. Its easier to take your training in small doses when you keep up as opposed to trying to comprehend the software changes from 2-3 releases all at once. These are just a few of the factors.
    C:> ED WORKING....

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    Default Re: Subscription & shelfware

    Quote Originally Posted by Ed Jobe View Post
    Rather than the amount of time that the software sits on the shelf, I think that the variables that cause it to sit on the shelf are more important. They can vary widely from comany to company. Sometimes its just manpower and workload that determine when it gets installed. You can be so busy that you don't have time to make the change. Here it is often schedule/workload conflicts between departments e.g. the IT dept is too busy. Another dept is always hesitant to upgrade because it consists mainly of users that don't use acad very often and are intolerant of any change. They feel that upgrading is counter-productive. However, there is significant proof here that falling too far behind produces a training lag that's hard to overcome. Its easier to take your training in small doses when you keep up as opposed to trying to comprehend the software changes from 2-3 releases all at once. These are just a few of the factors.
    Well put. I am the only CAD support person at my company, and in addition to getting us set up for AutoCAD 2008 I also have to handle user problems, project data handling, setting up for new clients, license/software updates, user training, the list goes on. Some days I'm so busy bailing out the Titanic with a tea cup I don't have time to design a ship that won't sink to replace it with.
    If you are going to fly by the seat of your pants, expect friction burns.
    Some say beauty is in the eye of the Beholder... perhaps so, but I've only seen the disintegration beam.
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  5. #5
    I could stop if I wanted to michael.12445's Avatar
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    Default Re: Subscription & shelfware

    cadtag,

    Our experience is similar to yours, at least in the last couple of years. We spent the last year or so moving from 2002 to subscription-based 2006 (partly due to a company merger), which we are still using. 2007 stayed on the shelf, and one person in our partner company is trying, with some difficulty, to deploy 2008 there.

    But even "we're using 2006" is only partially true, because no one is using sheet sets or dynamic blocks. People would rather struggle along with what they already know than take on the extra burden of learning something new. Given that, I don't see us moving to 2008 any time soon.

    Michael Evans
    Togawa Smith Martin Residential, Inc.

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    Certified AUGI Addict jaberwok's Avatar
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    Default Re: Subscription & shelfware

    Quote Originally Posted by michael.12445 View Post
    But even "we're using 2006" is only partially true, because no one is using sheet sets or dynamic blocks. People would rather struggle along with what they already know than take on the extra burden of learning something new.
    That's good point and a logical extension to the original question - who is using a recent version as if it were an older one?

    In all but one of the clients that I've worked for in the past five years I could have done everything they needed by using R12.
    John B

    "You can't convince a believer of anything; for their belief is not based on evidence, it's based on a deep-seated need to believe." - Carl Sagan

  7. #7
    Forum Manager, Administrator Ed Jobe's Avatar
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    Default Re: Subscription & shelfware

    Quote Originally Posted by jaberwok View Post
    In all but one of the clients that I've worked for in the past five years I could have done everything they needed by using R12.
    A lot of mech industries are like that, and it can vary from company to company. Some of what we do (build subsations) is like that, e.g. electrical, but arch and civil are not. There are so many different reasons that it doesn't really do much good to get a poll of what everyone else is doing. Rather, use the suggestions here to study your own needs.
    C:> ED WORKING....

  8. #8
    Certifiable AUGI Addict cadtag's Avatar
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    Default Re: Subscription & shelfware

    Quote Originally Posted by jonathanschade View Post
    ...

    ... You actually can own a copy of 2008 and install it as 2006.

    that's only true if you bought the 2006 seat _as_ 2006, and put that license under subscription prior to upgrading. That particular benefit of subscription only enables running previous versions under subscription. If you bought 2006, upgraded to 2008 and put that 2008 seat under subscription, then the 2006 is supposed to be uninstalled.

    If you only purchased the 2008 version, or upgrade 2006 to 2008 and then out it under subscription, you can't run any earlier versions, but will be able to run 2008 if the next upgrade is not workable for you.
    Real pirates wear silk suits & ties, and write EULAs
    The only thing more dangerous to the liberty of a free people than big government, is big business.

    Toward a Sustainable Water Future: Visions for 2050 http://ascelibrary.org/doi/book/10.1061/9780784412077

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    Default Re: Subscription & shelfware

    I would encourage keeping up to date with Acad software, even when any new features are not being used. I would encourage users to check the new features and see if it can benefit productivity. There is no reason that users should be "burdoned" learning new features. Standing still in this day and age is equivalent to going backwards.

    Leo

  10. #10
    All AUGI, all the time Richard.Kent's Avatar
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    Default Re: Subscription & shelfware

    Quote Originally Posted by cadtag View Post
    that's only true if you bought the 2006 seat _as_ 2006, and put that license under subscription prior to upgrading. That particular benefit of subscription only enables running previous versions under subscription. If you bought 2006, upgraded to 2008 and put that 2008 seat under subscription, then the 2006 is supposed to be uninstalled.

    If you only purchased the 2008 version, or upgrade 2006 to 2008 and then out it under subscription, you can't run any earlier versions, but will be able to run 2008 if the next upgrade is not workable for you.
    I just read the T&C for subscriptions and I don't read it that way. Sounds to me like if you are on subscription you can also run older versions on the same computer. I don't see where it specifically stated that the older software had to have also been on subscription.

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