Draft by Layer vs By Entity

[simon_t_hall]

I'm looking for a definition of what drafting by layer is and what drafting by entity is. it is somthing that I cannot find and I seem to be having some problems with other users here and I think it is a definition problem (and I'm probably in error)

Cheers
Simon

[jaberwok]

In my experience, most people agree that the properties (colour, linetype, etc.) of objects should be set to "bylayer". The main advantage being that the properties assigned to a layer can be changed and all the objects on that layer will change.
The alternative is to set explicit colours, linetypes, etc for individual objects.

BTW, creating geometry that is to be used only as a block creates a special case - block geometry will normally be created on layer 0 (zero).

HTH

[dgorsman]

I can give an excellent example of this. On one of my past projects, the lead wanted certain objects to plot thicker. No problem, I said - thirty seconds (even though we had a hundred or so drawings at that point). I adjusted the CTB (no, I don't want to get into that discussion here), and because object color was BYLAYER, nothing in the drawings needed to be changed. If the objects had color/lineweight/plot style set by entity, every one of those drawings would have to be reprocessed one at a time to change every. single. object.

[simon_t_hall]

Yeah, the problem that I am having seems to be one of terminology, or convention. Different people in this office seem to have differing opinions as to what is Bylayer and what is Byentity and there are several different opinions.

In short the way I was taught (note that I have been on AutoCAD for about 4-5 years, previously on a Unix based CAD program) That bylayer was when the standard layers replicated pen/linetype cominations eg.
C01 - Continuous / Pen 1
C02 - Continuous / Pen 2
D01 - Dashed / Pen 1
T25 - Text / 2.5 / Pen 3
etc.

And By entity was Naming layers by the entity that you are drafting eg
Slab
Soffit
Top Reo
Btm Reo
Text
Tags
Walls
etc
In most cases there is a predominate colour / Linetype combination set, however (in the case of say top_reo layer) there may be incidental text or linetypes that are set with alternate colours but on the same layer to do away with redundant layers.

By my way of learning drafting by layer is a dated way of drafting done when drafting in MS where there was little switching off of layers to manipulate the final look of the drawing.

Drafting by entity is a modern way where layers can be turned off by entity in viewports however there is still an element of bylayer to facilitate control over the drawings.

I'm not trying to start any arguments here, this is how I was trained, I rarely get into problems doing this as the layer naming is based on what layers will be manipulated, and most of the add on software seems to agree with my way of thinking, however the CAD Manual here seems to have a completely different opinion of what by layer is.

Cheers
SImon

[stelthorst]

Yeah, the problem that I am having seems to be one of terminology, or convention. Different people in this office seem to have differing opinions as to what is Bylayer and what is Byentity and there are several different opinions.

In short the way I was taught (note that I have been on AutoCAD for about 4-5 years, previously on a Unix based CAD program) That bylayer was when the standard layers replicated pen/linetype cominations eg.
C01 - Continuous / Pen 1
C02 - Continuous / Pen 2
D01 - Dashed / Pen 1
T25 - Text / 2.5 / Pen 3
etc.

And By entity was Naming layers by the entity that you are drafting eg
Slab
Soffit
Top Reo
Btm Reo
Text
Tags
Walls
etc
In most cases there is a predominate colour / Linetype combination set, however (in the case of say top_reo layer) there may be incidental text or linetypes that are set with alternate colours but on the same layer to do away with redundant layers.

By my way of learning drafting by layer is a dated way of drafting done when drafting in MS where there was little switching off of layers to manipulate the final look of the drawing.

Drafting by entity is a modern way where layers can be turned off by entity in viewports however there is still an element of bylayer to facilitate control over the drawings.

I'm not trying to start any arguments here, this is how I was trained, I rarely get into problems doing this as the layer naming is based on what layers will be manipulated, and most of the add on software seems to agree with my way of thinking, however the CAD Manual here seems to have a completely different opinion of what by layer is.

Cheers
SImon

Hi Simon,

Personally I like having layer names that represent what is on the layer. Slab definitely makes more sense to me than C01 for a layer name.

My general rule for layers is; If there is a need or reason for an entity to be printed differently or a need to be able to isolate an entity than a new layer should be created.

An example would be; I think text should be on a different layer than conduit since sometimes I need to show only the conduit on the drawing without it's associated text but I have never understood why some people have a separate layer for leaders as I have never had a need to print a drawing with only the leaders but not the text associated to the leaders.

Just my 2c.

[simon_t_hall]

So to me, You draft by entity?!?

This is in general the principle I use to reduce the number of layers, I try to stay below 10 layers per xref (where practical)

For what I draft, the I take the 1% chance that there may be a global problem with the job for the time saving of having any draughtsman from any discipline understand My groups drawings.

Cheers
Simon

[Harold Pei Jr]

Yeah, the problem that I am having seems to be one of terminology, or convention. Different people in this office seem to have differing opinions as to what is Bylayer and what is Byentity and there are several different opinions.

In short the way I was taught (note that I have been on AutoCAD for about 4-5 years, previously on a Unix based CAD program) That bylayer was when the standard layers replicated pen/linetype cominations eg.
C01 - Continuous / Pen 1
C02 - Continuous / Pen 2
D01 - Dashed / Pen 1
T25 - Text / 2.5 / Pen 3
etc.

And By entity was Naming layers by the entity that you are drafting eg
Slab
Soffit
Top Reo
Btm Reo
Text
Tags
Walls
etc
In most cases there is a predominate colour / Linetype combination set, however (in the case of say top_reo layer) there may be incidental text or linetypes that are set with alternate colours but on the same layer to do away with redundant layers.

By my way of learning drafting by layer is a dated way of drafting done when drafting in MS where there was little switching off of layers to manipulate the final look of the drawing.

Drafting by entity is a modern way where layers can be turned off by entity in viewports however there is still an element of bylayer to facilitate control over the drawings.

I'm not trying to start any arguments here, this is how I was trained, I rarely get into problems doing this as the layer naming is based on what layers will be manipulated, and most of the add on software seems to agree with my way of thinking, however the CAD Manual here seems to have a completely different opinion of what by layer is.

Cheers
SImon

So basically, they draft by layers, it's just that their layers are named after what's on it?
That's like you holding up an apple, saying it's a fruit, someone saying it's an apple, and you two arguing the other is wrong.
It's the same thing, you just see it in a different way than the others in your office. I'm guessing they did not have any MS training prior. This may be where they don't see what you're trying to tell them.

[simon_t_hall]

Yeah, that is pretty much the situation.

My concern here is, the revised CAD Manual is about to be released, and in said manual it states that we draft bylayer, then in the very next line states that layers are named by entity.

The wording is causing some confusion, and some anger among the drafties who will not go back to C01, C02 layer naming and the loss of control over the drawings this would cause.

I had a conversation with a long time drafty earlier today who added this little bit of food for thought. His idea was that as AutoCAD has developed over time the convention of Bylayer or Byentity has also developed to a point that ByLayer is a hybrid of By layer and by entity to suit VP manupulation, and by entity really doesn't exist. You either draft by (hybrid) layer or draft on layer 0

[jaberwok]

As you say, it seems like a difference in terminology.
I'd say it's "layer(names)s by object" v "layer(names)s by type".
Everyone seems to agree on "drawing by layer" and Harold's analogy seems apt.

[RICHARD_JONES]

.......My concern here is, the revised CAD Manual is about to be released, and in said manual it states that we draft bylayer, then in the very next line states that layers are named by entity.

The wording is causing some confusion, and some anger among the drafties who will not go back to C01, C02 layer naming and the loss of control over the drawings this would cause......

That is the first time I’ve seen the use of “by layer” used that way. But once that issue is cleared up, I don’t think that the wording in the CAD Manual is all that confusing.

“we draft by layer” ----- Color, linetype, lineweight, etc. for each layer are set to “bylayer”. If you want to go deeper, items in the your dimension style would also be set to bylayer.

“layers are named by entity.” ------ Your layer names are descriptive of the objects being drawn. So you would not use layers named as C01, C02, etc.