Stacked walls and identity data

[clog boy]

We're having serious issues with scheduling our stacked walls. The individual sections or the stacked wall as an entity can't seem to contain identity data, and that's vital to make a quantity breakdown of our residential projects.

Anyone have a viable explanation why we can't do it at the moment, or how to implement a workaround? This issue exists in RAC2009 and RAC2010.

[Scott Womack]

We're having serious issues with scheduling our stacked walls. The individual sections or the stacked wall as an entity can't seem to contain identity data, and that's vital to make a quantity breakdown of our residential projects.

Anyone have a viable explanation why we can't do it at the moment, or how to implement a workaround? This issue exists in RAC2009 and RAC2010.

IF you use the Material Take off schedules, applied to walls, it will pick up the area of those walls. IF you are trying to schedule them for some other purpose, it may schedule the individual pieces of the stacked wall. I know that you can tag the individual pieces of the stacked wall.

[clog boy]

Thanks Scott,

We don't use material takeoff. We schedule a more specific than that, for instance we have adapted the Assembly Code file (Uniformat Classifications, reformatted it to NL-sfb) and even that is a little too rough. We also made a project parameter to manually input the level of that wall and some other stuff so that our supplier can crosscheck the drawing with the schedule.

The gripe is that stacked wall elements can't have a mark, comment or any project parameter. I'm looking for a reasonable explanation so I can tell the manager why Revit is not a broken tool.

[Scott Womack]

Thanks Scott,

We don't use material takeoff. We schedule a more specific than that, for instance we have adapted the Assembly Code file (Uniformat Classifications, reformatted it to NL-sfb) and even that is a little too rough. We also made a project parameter to manually input the level of that wall and some other stuff so that our supplier can crosscheck the drawing with the schedule.

The gripe is that stacked wall elements can't have a mark, comment or any project parameter.

Sorry I couldn't help more. Part of my problem is understanding how you are using stacked walls? A Stacked wall is just a "container" to hold other previously defined wall styles in a given alignment. It would normally be the individual wall styles or "pieces" of the stacked wall that are important. So why is "scheduling" the stacked wall so much of an issue? Is someone shop-building, or prefabricating a wall that has multiple types of wall construction within it?

[clog boy]

Sorry I couldn't help more. Part of my problem is understanding how you are using stacked walls? A Stacked wall is just a "container" to hold other previously defined wall styles in a given alignment. It would normally be the individual wall styles or "pieces" of the stacked wall that are important. So why is "scheduling" the stacked wall so much of an issue? Is someone shop-building, or prefabricating a wall that has multiple types of wall construction within it?

It's quite common for architects to dictate several layers of different colored bricks in a residential project, or darker bricks up to sill level and then regular red/orange bricks from there. You wouldn't believe how much of a Mondriaan architects can make from that brick canvas. And you want to be able to get reliable quantities, up to the last square foot.

Two examples of Dutch architectural glory: [/sarcasm]
http://static.realworks.nl/cms//903784///Waterhoen.JPG
http://www.wateringse-binnentuinen.nl/uploads/hofkwartier-2.jpg

And believe me, it gets fancier than that. Like it or loath it.

[Scott Womack]

I assume that you know you don't have to use a stacked wall just for changing colors (or materials" in a wall that are all the same thickness? Just changing colors of brick or from 4" brick to 4" stone does not need a stacked wall? You can do this within a standard "composite" wall.

[clog boy]

Right, I know that. But it just isn't practical for scenarios where for instance, between windows, you'd have three layers of grey, one layer of white, three layers of grey etc. Must admit it's quite incidental but it happens.
If your suggestion is the recomended approach then I'll instruct my fellow CADmen and -women.

Still leaves to question why instance parameters don't apply for stacked walls.

[twiceroadsfool]

Youre thinking of a Stacked Wall as its own *entity,* when Revit doesnt see it that way. Revit sees the Stacked Wall tool as simply a convenient way to draw Basic walls on top of one another and keep them related. Its similar to a Model Group.

It would be great if Model Groups and Stacked walls could have identity data, Mark values, Type Mark values, Type comment values, etc... It would just be complex because their definitions would still depend on the native definitions of the objects that construct them.

It *IS* silly that the Basic walls cant have comments or a mark value... But for what yoiure doing the material values in them wont suffice? They have Length, Area, and Volume in them... Which- for different shades of brick- seems like it would suffice?

[clog boy]

It *IS* silly that the Basic walls cant have comments or a mark value... But for what yoiure doing the material values in them wont suffice? They have Length, Area, and Volume in them... Which- for different shades of brick- seems like it would suffice?

Yup, they will tell you all that, but just not for which wall. Would you believe that brickwork on groundlevel is cheaper than on 2nd and 3rd floor?

[twiceroadsfool]

Id absolutely believe it... Some poor guy has to climb the scaffolding to get to the second floor, lifts to get the palette of bricks that high versus having it sit on the ground, etc.

Thats a very valid NEED for being able to give those elements that data. I would file a Support Request, but not just explain that you need it. GIVE THEM that explanation. I understand the need now, but five minutes ago i wasnt thinking about it, and it wouldnt have occured to me. Ive found if i give them lengthy explanations about why i need certain things, it tends to help (not that youll get it right now regardless, but still...)