Desktop Replacement

[mnisbett]

I'm looking for some feedback on desktop replacement machines. I'll be running AutoCAD, VIZ, Revit, LDD, ADT, Inventor, Photoshop, and Illustrator. Basically I'm looking at two large notebooks right now, Dell's Inspiron 9200 Pentium® M 755 Processor (2GHz/400MHz FSB) or gateway m675xl Pentium 4 HT 3.4 Ghz. Both machines have 17" screens, 80 Gig HD's, 1 Gig RAM, 126Meg Video, and both are hefty.
Is it better to go with Pentium M or Pentium 4 HT?
Thanks

[mjfarrell]

In short, there are no or few Laptops that can serve as
geuine replacements for a robust Desktop CAD workstation.
You can't get the same volume of RAM nor multiple Hard drives
or massive video cards.

The upside is, IF you spent the same money on a desktop
you would be able to build a much stronger faster machine
and still have money left over.

[hand471037]

I'd say the M vs. P4 is going to depend on how much time you'll spend unplugged. The M will give you much more battery life, the P4 much less but it will be a little faster. I've got a laptop with a P4 HT and my battery lasts about an hour and a half. Not a lot of time, really, and it's one of the huge downsides to the 'desktop replacement' style of laptops. You think now that it's not an issue, and that you'll always be plugged in somewhere, but as soon as you start using a laptop it quickly wants to go with you everywhere, and after your first plane ride together you might wish for the M and it's five-hour battery life. :)

Another thing to consider is how much you really need that 17" screen. 17" laptops don't fit in normal laptop bags, are much heavier, and more cumbersome. Could you instead just get a nice LCD monitor to plug into at home, and use a smaller screen on the road? My Sager is a 15", but runs at a nice resolution, and so it actually works out well without the larger screen.

The final thing to consider is how Mobile do you really need to be. You can get laptops (like mine) that can support 2 gigs of ram, real graphics cards, and real P4's; but they are heavy, have poor battery life, and are more expensive than a desktop. And much more prone to breaking and theft. Why do you need to be mobile, I guess is what I'm asking. Because you might be better off getting a used laptop that can run your software (but not too quickly) for client/site visits and then have the home system that can run it really really well. The other option, these Desktop Replacements, like I use, are kinda the worse of both worlds- they aren't mobile enough to be a nice laptop, but aren't as powerful as a desktop either. However, having everything on one computer, that goes with you everywhere, it a terrifically liberating thing and I don't know if I'll ever be able to go back to a desktop. ;)

[bbapties]

"m" cause you can over clock more!!

must go faster!! yeah yeah!!!

[mnisbett]

I already have a desktop at home and work. But my kids use the one in the house most of the time now, and my office computer is fast but I really do most of my work at home. I'm not paying for the laptop so I figure I might as well go for the gusto. I'll plug in at my office to my 21" screen so I feel that 17" is a sacrifice. I thought I'd get an extra battery for the P4 if I go that route, and both come with carrying cases. My big thing is rendering is the P4 going to make a huge difference over the M. I've read that "unplugged" the processor steps down to save juice, so the laptop will be plugged in most of the time for rendering. Thats why I put an outlet on the Deck8)

[mnisbett]

Hey by the way how do you get those green reputation points? I've seen some people with 100+ posts and only one green thing and I saw some with one post and 3 thingys.:???:

[hand471037]

For rendering, the P4 HT will probably run faster than the M, due to the fact that it can act as two processors. Look at the Revit Rendering Benchmark thread to get an idea of the scores, I think there are a few 'M' processors on there. The M is very good at some things, but I think in raw rendering speed it's not as fast as a good full P4 HT, for it's not even as fast at rendering than a P4-M.

Here:
http://www6.tomshardware.com/mobile/20030205/index.html

However, if you're going to be doing any 'real' rendering work you'd be better off getting a second cheap fast desktop, and off-loading the rendering work to that machine. That way the desktop can burn away for days if need be on something huge, and you can continue working away on the laptop...

[Wanderer]

For rendering, the P4 HT will probably run faster than the M, due to the fact that it can act as two processors. Look at the Revit Rendering Benchmark thread to get an idea of the scores, I think there are a few 'M' processors on there. The M is very good at some things, but I think in raw rendering speed it's not as fast as a good full P4 HT, for it's not even as fast at rendering than a P4-M.

Here:
http://www6.tomshardware.com/mobile/20030205/index.html

However, if you're going to be doing any 'real' rendering work you'd be better off getting a second cheap fast desktop, and off-loading the rendering work to that machine. That way the desktop can burn away for days if need be on something huge, and you can continue working away on the laptop...
interesting thread. I am still looking for a laptop and want to be able to run revit on it... still trying to decide what is important to me. ;) thanks for the info...

as for the rep points, check out the following threads if you haven't already...
what happened to my reputation? (http://forums.augi.com/showthread.php?t=4063&page=1&pp=10&highlight=Reputation)
Reputation points (http://forums.augi.com/showthread.php?postid=39769#poststop)

[BillyGrey]

I don't know why I missed this thread earlier, but I surely would have thrown in my 2 cents!

I own an Acer 1710 series desktop replacement, and as far as price/performance, there is not a machine on the market that can touch it. I bought mine in Sept. 04, and it has evolved slightly since
then, but here are my spec.s

P4 3.0
1 gig of ram
120 meg 7200 rpm hd
true (not motion picture aspect) 17" monitor
128 meg nvidia go5700 w/128 meg of ram

This machine does anything I want, 8-12 hrs daily, and I am a full time Revit user.

I could really not have hoped for more, esp. at $1899.00

Go compare those spec's to any machine on the market and you will find yourself in the 2500.00 to 3500.00 range depending on who you look at.

Also, ram is upgradable to 2 gig (!).

This machine uses desktop components, so that means you can work on it much easier than a traditional latop, and you can upgrade things like your hard drive real simply.

Mind you, it is a desktop replacement, and heavy, but I take my show on the road one or two times a week, no prob.

HTH

Bill

[mnisbett]

Hey I'm still waiting for my gateway....over a month now!!!!! I hope the computer is faster than the delivery! I'll let you all know.

[Wes Macaulay]

I'm just in the throes of such a decision. Since we're a Dell shop, it's come down to the Inspiron 5160 because of its value.

The Pentium 4 hyperthreading CPU with this beast will chew thru the battery fast, no doubt. But getting a laptop with comparable performance and specs using the Pentium M or Centrino processor would have cost about 800 clams more.

At they very least you need to get a video card with its own RAM onboard with OpenGL support.

We have the older Inspiron 5150's that have had many problems in the power department, and we also have a Dell XPS which is super fast and super heavy.

Jeffrey's observations are spot-on.

[mnisbett]

I finally got my Gateway 675xl, it's a great machine. The wait wasn't so great, it took over a month and a half to get here. The screen is just awesome, it's crisp and clear. The screen is so nice it makes my 21" dell screen look like ****. The rendering speed on Viz is just as good as it's desktop counterparts. Autocad is awesome to run with the wide screen because there is plenty of room for palets and toolbars. Now that I have it, it was worth the wait, but it wasn't fun waiting. Speaking of wait <weight> it is heavy but it really isn't as bad as some reviews make it out to be, my legs don't get numb, just a little hot.

[robert.1.hall72202]

Why would you use a laptop for drafting????
Leave that in an airport and see how long you it takes you to switch
back to a desktop system.

[mnisbett]

Why would you use a laptop for drafting????
Leave that in an airport and see how long you it takes you to switch
back to a desktop system.
I tried a laptop for 6 months before I decided I didn't need my desktop anymore. With a docking station at work hooked up to my 21" monitor as well as keyboard, mouse, sound, and network its as easy as clicking in my laptop. At home the 17" screen, wireless mouse, wireless internet, and full size keyboard doesn't make me miss my desktop at all. The machine itself is extremely fast and I've tested it against simlilar desktops. No difference at all. As far as airports I don't go there.

[Wes Macaulay]

I'd have to agree. I wouldn't recommend these Dell 5160's for people who don't like carrying around 10lbs of hardware (OOF!), but for about 3,000 Canadian clams (tax inc) you get full power you can take on the road.

[robert.1.hall72202]

I tried a laptop for 6 months before I decided I didn't need my desktop anymore. With a docking station at work hooked up to my 21" monitor as well as keyboard, mouse, sound, and network its as easy as clicking in my laptop. At home the 17" screen, wireless mouse, wireless internet, and full size keyboard doesn't make me miss my desktop at all. The machine itself is extremely fast and I've tested it against simlilar desktops. No difference at all. As far as airports I don't go there.

Who wants to work at home????? jokingly (dont put in for a laptop)

Ive always liked a desktop system....a notebook computer cannot outlive the desktop system. Is their a notebook out there that can run raid hardrives, have more than 12 usb/firewire ports, and the list goes on. I'm too high tech to use a notebook, even with being portable. As for power, I have yet to see a notebook that can turn around a 25mb iges file before the coffee heats up.

[mnisbett]

Ok Its time to resurrect this Thread. My Gateway 675XL has been a great machine. I've had no problems with it and it has always performed great. The Pentium 4 HT technology is still good, BUT. I think its time to look at newer Technologies.
Does anyone use Core Duo technology? Pentium M? What is the best processor right now? I could go on using this Gateway but I'd like to upgrade the HD's and the RAM so I'm thinking new machine. I've looked at the new Acer 5800, Core Duo 2 GIG of Ram, 120 GIG HD, and Screaming ATI card. Also looked at Dell XPS and Alienware. Is it true Dell bought Alienware? Anyway thanks for your thoughts of wisdom ahead of time.
Mark-

[Mike.Perry]

<SNIP>

Is it true Dell bought Alienware?

<SNIP>Hi

Yep! take a look here ( Dell adds Alienware to PC empire (http://news.cnet.co.uk/desktops/0,39029662,49258759,00.htm) ).

Have a good one, Mike

[mnisbett]

I finally got the new machine . An HP nw9440. Its a 17" portable workstation, 2 gig of RAM, 512 Quadro video, 80 GB SATA hard drive, lightscibe dvd, and fingerprint recognition. So far its been great. I did a photon render with VIZ on the former gateway machine, it took 1.5 hrs. The same on the HP took 20 min.

[Wanderer]

I finally got the new machine . An HP nw9440. Its a 17" portable workstation, 2 gig of RAM, 512 Quadro video, 80 GB SATA hard drive, lightscibe dvd, and fingerprint recognition. So far its been great. I did a photon render with VIZ on the former gateway machine, it took 1.5 hrs. The same on the HP took 20 min.That sounds pretty sweet. I ended up getting the Dell Inspiron 9400 (http://www.dell.com/content/products/features.aspx/inspn_9400?c=us&cs=04&l=en&s=bsd) E1705. I haven't done anything heavy-duty on it yet, but, I'm sure it will be able to handle anything my work throws at it (I don't do viz or complex renders :( )
Thanks for sharing. :)

[Wes Macaulay]

Mark, does this new computer have a backlit keyboard? I see the laptop has an ambient light sensor. If I had known all the times I'd be working in locations where I wasn't getting good light on the keyboard, it would have factored in to my choice of laptop!

[mnisbett]

Mark, does this new computer have a backlit keyboard? I see the laptop has an ambient light sensor. If I had known all the times I'd be working in locations where I wasn't getting good light on the keyboard, it would have factored in to my choice of laptop!Wes, It does not have a back lit keyboard, although I wish it did. I had an IBM a couple of years ago that had a built in light at the top of screen that worked good for dark situations. As an alternative there are USB lights.