Walls of same type will not Join

[bpayne]

This is strange....my project wall types will not join correctly. The attached pdf shows one wall type. I used the rectangle line tool to create the four walls, and they will not join together.

Any suggestions....?

[bpayne]

Ok, so I found the culprit....as soon as I re-lock the layers to each other, which I was using to stretch the finish beyond the bottom of wall....they all join. Is there no way to do both?

[Craig_L]

This is a killer which I find architects manage to do in almost every job.
Edit profile is the culprit, every single time.
The architect (or initial modeller of the wall) needs to make sure of a few things which will stop this problem occurring:
1. Where possible, try not to use edit profile at all, rather model small pieces of wall with the correct properties to achieve steps, cutaways, etc in walls.

2. Never edit profile of the bottom of the wall. It's a simple adjustment in the element properties to set the wall (for example) as +200 above its base level. If you edit the profile of the BOTTOM of a wall, it will (I repeat WILL) affect the structural person trying to attach a footing to the bottom of that wall (which once profile edited, steps up in mid air, quite impressive on a multi level high rise to see footings floating around level 40)

3. Instead of edit profile at the top of wall, a much more effective way, and a way that will actually adjust should your project change, is to "attach element" at the top, usually underside of sheeting is best, or even better, a reference plane named accordingly. Should either reference plane (or sheeting that you have modelled) shift, the walls will adjust their top, rather than having to edit all your wall profiles.
Also, walls with their tops shaved off with edit profile will give errors when attempting to model structural steel that attaches along the face of this wall, and it will also give errors if you attempt to model any reo in the edit profile wall.

It's really best to avoid using this tool, it does work well for cutouts, but then again, why not just use an opening tool??

In short, edit profile is horrible, avoid it when you can, it has it's uses but if you at least try never to use it in the above 3 cases, it will make collaboration much easier!

[bpayne]

Great advise...except that I didn't edit the profile :) ....I just unlocked the finish layers. That's it!

4 walls, same type, nothing changed except for unlocking the finish, and bam...they are broken!

[Ning Zhou]

Edit profile is the culprit, every single time.

It's really best to avoid using this tool, it does work well for cutouts, but then again, why not just use an opening tool??

In short, edit profile is horrible, avoid it when you can, it has it's uses but if you at least try never to use it in the above 3 cases, it will make collaboration much easier!

totally agree! use it only as last option, too many users just overuse it, including me sometimes.

[bpayne]

Is anybody actually reading what I wrote?....this is getting ridiculous.... This thread has nothing to do with editing the profile of a wall. It is about unlocking the layers of a wall and the effect that has on wall joins.

I would love an actual response to the topic of the thread!

[gaby424]

post the file. here i test it and it works.

[patricks]

Folks - the OP's problem DOES NOT have ANYTHING to do with editing profiles of walls. It has everything to do with base extension distance and view range.

If you have walls with unlocked base layers that extend below the base level of the wall, and your view depth is set to anything below 0' - 0" for that view's host level, you will get the results you have seen, unless you set the wall joins to Miter. Setting the joins to miter makes the join look correct in plan, but then if the top or base extensions of your walls aren't the same height, then it won't be correct there.

This has been a problem since at least 2005 or earlier. Still no effort from ADSK to fix it, it seems.

[bpayne]

Thanks Patricks...I was hoping you, one of the Scotts, or any of the other veterans would chime in. I'll try seeing if I can live with the limited view depth or mitered corners.

[Craig_L]

Are these multi-component walls?
ie several layers of different material?

[bpayne]

yes, typical brick cavity wall....brick, air, sheathing, stud, gyp

[Craig_L]

Ah yes well that explains it, these walls never want to behave properly, ideally I would suggest modelling the wall to only contain the non-structural elements, ie sheeting stud, and cavity (not the block portion) and copy/monitor in the block wall from the structural model, or model this piece as a standalone piece if you're not using a structures team. Those multi-component walls are a nightmare for people preparing structural documents and, also they really don't function quite properly yet

[Scott Womack]

Ah yes well that explains it, these walls never want to behave properly, ideally I would suggest modelling the wall to only contain the non-structural elements, ie sheeting stud, and cavity (not the block portion) and copy/monitor in the block wall from the structural model, or model this piece as a standalone piece if you're not using a structures team. Those multi-component walls are a nightmare for people preparing structural documents and, also they really don't function quite properly yet

Interesting....

We prepare construction documents, AND use mutli-component exterior walls extensively. The only place we have where cleanup is an issue is where the length of the piece of wall is less that 2x the wall thickness. Then it will fight cleaning up.

We even use stacked walls where the walls making them up are of different heights, and they clean up.

I have even gotten the condition being described to clean up..... usually. This can also be an issue if the bottom projection is extensive, compared to the overall wall height.

[patricks]

I have even gotten the condition being described to clean up..... usually. This can also be an issue if the bottom projection is extensive, compared to the overall wall height.

Any idea how, besides changing to a miter join? It's never worked for me in my 6+ years of Revit, unless you can live with a 0 view depth setting.