Polyline thickness problem, google has not shown any result

[wannabe1988]

Dear friends, I have been having headache of trying to fix the polyline thickness in autocad2012. My polylines of 0.45mm keep showing an unusual thick line. I have set the plinewid to 0 and change the default line thickness to 0 as well. I have other drawings that use the same ctb in the problematic drawing but the other drawings are showing fine even when the line is set to be as thick as 0.45mm. The problem occur only with this single line thickness of 0.45mm. Please help. I am currently using auto cad 2012 and use a ctb based plot.

[wannabe1988]

also, I have played around with the line weight scale but has not achieved any positive result. anyway, The problem happened in the plotting stage when I was trying to convert dog to pdf.

[jaberwok]

I assume you're talking about "width" - in acad-speak, "thickness" is measured in the z-axis.
Are you saying that your plines should all display as zero width on-screen?

Perhaps you have lineweight display switched on in just this one drawing.

From Help -

LWDISPLAY
Type: Integer
Saved in: Drawing
Initial value: OFF

Controls whether the lineweights of objects are displayed.

This setting is controlled separately for model space and for all paper space layouts.

OFF Lineweights are not displayed

ON Lineweights are displayed

[wannabe1988]

I assume you're talking about "width" - in acad-speak, "thickness" is measured in the z-axis.
Are you saying that your plines should all display as zero width on-screen?

Perhaps you have lineweight display switched on in just this one drawing.

From Help -

Hi thanks for the reply. It's not about the line thickness being displayed on the screen. It's mostly about the line thickness behaving in a way that I did not expect when I was attempting to print to pdf. Line thickness seems fine in both model and paper space but when I preview them under the plot dialog, my thickest line is way too thick in relative to other lines. I used the same ctb on another document but it came out fine.

[Norton_cad]

It may be a driver issue with your plot. eg. if your plotting to a pdf, try dowloading a updated driver.
Or it ould be a line merge issue, if you have lines on top of each other, which can be tweaked in the pen settings in the preferances.

[irneb]

There's quite a lot of things which might interfere with this. You state that the preview also seems wrong: if so I "think" the problem might lay elsewhere than the driver. Though I wouldn't totally exclude that possibility.

A few things which may be causing such (by no means exhaustive):


One DWG may be using CTB and the other STB. These might be different; also:
Check colour / plot style & line-weight settings for both the object and the layer it's on.
Is your print done at 1:1 or are you scaling it to be printed on a different size page? If so check the "scale lightweights option".
Are you setting the polyline's width property in the properties palette or is this a setting for its line-weight. Note the CTB/STB overrides the line-weight, so colour / plot style could overrule the lineweight. Set the object/layer to a colour/plot style which is set to use object line weights instead of a specified width.

[wannabe1988]

hello thank you again for the reply. How do you update a driver? by the way, the line thickness display are not showing either in my model space but they do show in paper space. is that normal?

I just realise when I change the scale from 1:200 (the original size that I wanted) to 1:50, the line thickness look correct. However,changing the linetype scale doesn't help to show a correct line thickness either. how should I go about to create a 1:200 correct line weight drawings?

[jaberwok]

hello thank you again for the reply. How do you update a driver? by the way, the line thickness display are not showing either in my model space but they do show in paper space. is that normal?

I just realise when I change the scale from 1:200 (the original size that I wanted) to 1:50, the line thickness look correct. However,changing the linetype scale doesn't help to show a correct line thickness either. how should I go about to create a 1:200 correct line weight drawings?

Linetype scale has absolutely no effect on line WIDTH.

[irneb]

I think you're misunderstanding lineweights. Lineweights are governed by the plot settings (mostly). E.g. in the plot dialog the Plot Style governs the line weights. If you can't see the plot style drop-down, then click the round button at the bottom right with a greater-than sign to expand the dialog. Then at the top-right you should see the plot styles (either CTB or STB depending on the drawing file's setup):
82432
If you click the button just to the right of the drop-down you open the style editor. Each colour or style has several settings, one of which is the line weight. If that colour / style is set to "Use object lineweight" then (and only then) does that lineweight property you set in the properties palette / layer manager have any effect whatsoever.

Now those lineweights (mine's displayed in millimetres) are "supposed" to be real-world sizes - i.e. how they should print out. Usually they're pretty close, sometimes only slightly off with stuff like PDF. But there's a time when they can go haywire: If the Plot dialog is set to print at any scale other than 1:1 then your line weights stay put, unless you also check the "Scale lineweights".

About model-space: It's a pain since some of the features available in paperspace is simply not working in model space. You can't preview the lineweights effectively while on the model tab - only while on one of the PS tabs. MS lineweights don't seem to work well as they're goverened by your current zoom factor - not so much by the plot setting.

[wannabe1988]

I think you're misunderstanding lineweights. Lineweights are governed by the plot settings (mostly). E.g. in the plot dialog the Plot Style governs the line weights. If you can't see the plot style drop-down, then click the round button at the bottom right with a greater-than sign to expand the dialog. Then at the top-right you should see the plot styles (either CTB or STB depending on the drawing file's setup):
82432
If you click the button just to the right of the drop-down you open the style editor. Each colour or style has several settings, one of which is the line weight. If that colour / style is set to "Use object lineweight" then (and only then) does that lineweight property you set in the properties palette / layer manager have any effect whatsoever.

Now those lineweights (mine's displayed in millimetres) are "supposed" to be real-world sizes - i.e. how they should print out. Usually they're pretty close, sometimes only slightly off with stuff like PDF. But there's a time when they can go haywire: If the Plot dialog is set to print at any scale other than 1:1 then your line weights stay put, unless you also check the "Scale lineweights".

About model-space: It's a pain since some of the features available in paperspace is simply not working in model space. You can't preview the lineweights effectively while on the model tab - only while on one of the PS tabs. MS lineweights don't seem to work well as they're goverened by your current zoom factor - not so much by the plot setting.

Hello, thank you for the detail reply and I have understand quite a bit about the line weight now. I am currently using CTB and have set the line weight to "use object line weight". However the problem still persist. I have attached screenshots showing two drawings; one with problem (left) and the other which is fine (Right). they both are using the same ctb except that the problematic one is scaled to 1:200 under A3 size where as the correct version used 1:50 under A1 size

Let me know if you could figure something out from these screen shots as I am getting a little desperate about my situation and I am really thankful for whatever advices that you can offer.

edit: the thickest line which is the concrete wall is set at 0.45mm and the partition line (second thickest) is 0.3mm. They are both the extra bold line thickness shown on the first image.

[wannabe1988]

Hello, thank you for the detail reply and I have understand quite a bit about the line weight now. I am currently using CTB and have set the line weight to "use object line weight". However the problem still persist. I have attached screenshots showing two drawings; one with problem (left) and the other which is fine (Right). they both are using the same ctb except that the problematic one is scaled to 1:200 under A3 size where as the correct version used 1:50 under A1 size

Let me know if you could figure something out from these screen shots as I am getting a little desperate about my situation and I am really thankful for whatever advices that you can offer.

I have also added the configuration of my plot dialogue and the ctb option if they help. Thanks!

[jaberwok]

I'm just trying to get things straight here -

1. Your polylines are drawn with zero width?
2. Your polylines have lineweight set to by_layer?
3. The polylines are drawn on a layer with an assigned width of 0.45mm?
4. The polylines are drawn on a layer with an assigned colour of 1?
5. The polylines are drawn on a layer with an assigned plot style of Color_1?
6. The plot style Color_1 is set to use object lineweight?

[wannabe1988]

I'm just trying to get things straight here -

1. Your polylines are drawn with zero width?
2. Your polylines have lineweight set to by_layer?
3. The polylines are drawn on a layer with an assigned width of 0.45mm?
4. The polylines are drawn on a layer with an assigned colour of 1?
5. The polylines are drawn on a layer with an assigned plot style of Color_1?
6. The plot style Color_1 is set to use object lineweight?


Hello

1) yes
2) yes
3) yes, that is for the wall structural (i am an architectural student) which is also the thickest line in the current drawing
4 and 5) I am not really sure what do you mean by that. However just to clarify on the line thickness that I am using with the associate purposes:

grey = 0.1mm = details, background lines, tho detail
blue = 0.15mm = furniture, windows, brick,block layout, stud walls
Red = 0.18mm = Doors, Walls
Magenta = 0.25mm
Yellow = 0.3mm Plasterboard
Green = 0.45mm = Walls, section cuts
Cyan = 0.6mm Ground line

6) I have reset the colour 1 to 0.18mm according to the ctb that I am using.

[jaberwok]

Hello

1) yes
2) yes
3) yes, that is for the wall structural (i am an architectural student) which is also the thickest line in the current drawing
4 and 5) I am not really sure what do you mean by that. However just to clarify on the line thickness that I am using with the associate purposes:

grey = 0.1mm = details, background lines, tho detail
blue = 0.15mm = furniture, windows, brick,block layout, stud walls
Red = 0.18mm = Doors, Walls
Magenta = 0.25mm
Yellow = 0.3mm Plasterboard
Green = 0.45mm = Walls, section cuts
Cyan = 0.6mm Ground line

6) I have reset the colour 1 to 0.18mm according to the ctb that I am using.

Okay, I was assuming you were using colour 1 because that is what is highlighted in your screenshot. So change 4) 5) and 6) to refer to colour 3.

[wannabe1988]

Okay, I was assuming you were using colour 1 because that is what is highlighted in your screenshot. So change 4) 5) and 6) to refer to colour 3.

Hello, thank you for the prompt reply.

4 and 5) yup, the polylines are drawn with colour 3 which is green, thickest line in the drawing. If that helps, I use polyline throughout my drawings

6) no, the plot style colour 3 is not set to "use object line weight". it is set at 0.45mm

[irneb]

From your screenshots I'm assuming you did them from paper space (the white background and the Scale lineweights is enabled in the plot dialog). If not then you're out of luck, the preview in MS will never show correctly while editing.

Anyhow, from your 2 captures in post #10 it seems as if the 2 are a differing scales. As sample here's a capture from the same drawing (a section) which shows 2 viewports at different scales: left @ 1:100 and right @ 1:200. The thick lines (i.e. the retaining RC wall is drawn using Cyan - colour 4) has the Cyan colour's setting in CTB as 0.5mm. Notice that the lineweight is the same on the page, but relative to the scale it might appear "ticker" in comparison to the spaces between the lines.
82441

This is how it "should" work. It's as if you've selected a pen and drawn using that pen. The pen's width doesn't change because you're drawing at a different scale.

[wannabe1988]

From your screenshots I'm assuming you did them from paper space (the white background and the Scale lineweights is enabled in the plot dialog). If not then you're out of luck, the preview in MS will never show correctly while editing.

Anyhow, from your 2 captures in post #10 it seems as if the 2 are a differing scales. As sample here's a capture from the same drawing (a section) which shows 2 viewports at different scales: left @ 1:100 and right @ 1:200. The thick lines (i.e. the retaining RC wall is drawn using Cyan - colour 4) has the Cyan colour's setting in CTB as 0.5mm. Notice that the lineweight is the same on the page, but relative to the scale it might appear "ticker" in comparison to the spaces between the lines.
82441

This is how it "should" work. It's as if you've selected a pen and drawn using that pen. The pen's width doesn't change because you're drawing at a different scale.

hello, thank you for your reply. So it means the line thickness will not be affected by the scale of the drawings as they will adjust accordingly based on the scale in the paper space? Anyway, the left drawings is set to 1:200 in paper space where as the right drawings were set to 1:50.

I did all the modelling at 1:1 in Model space and then set the line colours in the layers. Then shift to paper space for arranging the layout and changing scales.

Surely the thickness of 0.3 and 0.45 is not too thick then if all the auto cad technical errors did not apply to my drawings?

[irneb]

What you're seeing is absolutely correct. As stated before, the Lineweight available in the Layer Manager (or the properties palette) does not work if the colour has a lineweight of its own. So setting this will not change anything to your green lines, they'll always plot as 0.45mm thick.

That's how it would work by default. If you want it some other way, then you have 2 options:


Modify CTB or create a new one with slightly thinner lines for use at larger scales.
Adjust the colours used for the layers differently. You may even use viewport overrides to have that colour difference applied only to the active viewport and not the drawing as a whole.

There's good & bad points in both scenarios. E.g. 1 won't work nicely if you have 2 viewports at different scales (like in my last screen capture). In such case I'd go with option 2. Though if your drawing's page only shows the one scale then option 1 is the least work to have it display correctly.

You'd usually want more detailed drawings to be drawn using thicker lines to make it appear less flat, while less detailed drawings would require thinner lines so they don't appear as dark. This is not a rule, more like a "feeling" about how you want your drawings to look.

We generally use option 1, having a Detail version of our CTB for scales ranging from 1:1 to 1:50. Then our "General" CTB has all the colours assigned to one weight less than in the Detail version, this one we use for scales 1:100 and onwards. Sometimes we adjust using option 2 on a viewport override if there's something like a detail blowup on the page.

BTW, if you go with option 2 (especially when using vp overrides) then look at using layer states to make your life a lot simpler.

[irneb]

...So it means the line thickness will not be affected by the scale of the drawings as they will adjust accordingly based on the scale in the paper space? ...Actually the line weight stays the same according to the page printed. It's the lines (or polylines or whatever) moving closer together or further appart due to the change in scale.

If you want to see this as a fact, set some temporary CTB file with a colour having one hugely thick line ... say 5.0mm. Setup 2 viewports on a page one at 1:50 and the other at 1:200 showing 2 lines 2000mm apart in model space. Print this page out at normal 1:1 scale. Use a ruler's 1:1 scaling to measure the thickness of these lines on the printed page, you'll find all 4 versions to be exactly 5.0mm wide - irrespective of the scale they were zoomed to in the viewport.

[wannabe1988]

Actually the line weight stays the same according to the page printed. It's the lines (or polylines or whatever) moving closer together or further appart due to the change in scale.

If you want to see this as a fact, set some temporary CTB file with a colour having one hugely thick line ... say 5.0mm. Setup 2 viewports on a page one at 1:50 and the other at 1:200 showing 2 lines 2000mm apart in model space. Print this page out at normal 1:1 scale. Use a ruler's 1:1 scaling to measure the thickness of these lines on the printed page, you'll find all 4 versions to be exactly 5.0mm wide - irrespective of the scale they were zoomed to in the viewport.


What you're seeing is absolutely correct. As stated before, the Lineweight available in the Layer Manager (or the properties palette) does not work if the colour has a lineweight of its own. So setting this will not change anything to your green lines, they'll always plot as 0.45mm thick.

That's how it would work by default. If you want it some other way, then you have 2 options:


Modify CTB or create a new one with slightly thinner lines for use at larger scales.
Adjust the colours used for the layers differently. You may even use viewport overrides to have that colour difference applied only to the active viewport and not the drawing as a whole.

There's good & bad points in both scenarios. E.g. 1 won't work nicely if you have 2 viewports at different scales (like in my last screen capture). In such case I'd go with option 2. Though if your drawing's page only shows the one scale then option 1 is the least work to have it display correctly.

You'd usually want more detailed drawings to be drawn using thicker lines to make it appear less flat, while less detailed drawings would require thinner lines so they don't appear as dark. This is not a rule, more like a "feeling" about how you want your drawings to look.

We generally use option 1, having a Detail version of our CTB for scales ranging from 1:1 to 1:50. Then our "General" CTB has all the colours assigned to one weight less than in the Detail version, this one we use for scales 1:100 and onwards. Sometimes we adjust using option 2 on a viewport override if there's something like a detail blowup on the page.

BTW, if you go with option 2 (especially when using vp overrides) then look at using layer states to make your life a lot simpler.


Thank you so much! I think I have finally gotten a grasp of my problem. I wasn't aware that different scale will put the lines nearer and vice-versa. In that case, it means that I need to setup two CTB, one for detail drawings and the other for general drawings.

Lastly, what do you mean by viewport overrides?

[irneb]

Lastly, what do you mean by viewport overrides?You're welcome!

Viewport overrides means you can set stuff like a layer's colour for only that one viewport. E.g. while you've got a viewport active on paper space, i.e. you've double clicked inside it, you can open the Layer Manager and you'll have a 2nd set of columns for colour, line type, line weight, transparency & plot style. If you change that the layer name (in the manager dialog) will get a blue background to show it's been overridden.

E.g. in attached you can see that the colour of 2 layers have been overridden, but also one of them has a new linetype.

This you can only do while inside a viewport. Thus you can only set it up for one viewport at a time. But after that you can save a layer state (one of the buttons on the top left of the manager dialog) and restore the saved state into another viewport. You can also export the layer state to a LAS file so you can import it into another DWG.

One caveat however: The polyline/line/whatever else needs to be set to ByLayer - otherwise you can do rather little with it.

[jaberwok]

for the sake of my curiosity please try this -

Using the -LAYER command (alias -LA) create a new layer - all its properties should have the default values.
Now create a couple of polylines fairly close together and fairly close to a couple of the troublesome polylines. Set the width of the new polylines (during the PLINE command or afterward with the PEDIT command) to 0.45mm.
Now try a plot preview.
If the new polylines look like the old, troublesome polylines, acad is working as it should.

[irneb]

If the new polylines look like the old, troublesome polylines, acad is working as it should.Yes, you could do that too. But then the polyline's width would more probably need to be set to 45.0 so it shows correctly at 1:100.

If you use the polyline's width property, that overrides all those lineweight settings - which is not always what you want. This property is fixed to the model space's units (whatever they are) and is not affected by any form of scaling. Thus if you print that same 45.0 wide polyline at 1:200 it will actually be printed at 0.225mm wide, if printed at 1:50 then it becomes 0.9mm wide.

I sometimes use these types of polylines to create a "shade" instead of a solid hatch - depends on the situation though. But this is seldom something I like doing, since in most instances you want a more consistent look to your drawings and using this technique you'll then have to make various versions of the same polyline (one for each scale you'll print them to). Not to mention, you'd need to fiddle around with layers to VP Freeze according to the scale you want.

[kebabman]

Hi
I am new to autocad architecture and I seem to be having the problem that when I create a pdf file the polylines show up as being far thicker than they were on the sheet or any of the other drawings. I have read through this thread and tried various things but with no success. Any help would be very gratefully received.

[kebabman]

Just wasted a whole morning but its Ok now, I just needed to select AIA LWT by object seems to have fixed it

[irneb]

Yep, that would be the CTB/STB settings in the plot dialog for those not using ACA.