A couple of questions

[stuartw]

I an brand new to revit. In fact I have just completed by 2nd days introduction training, with one more to come. Overall I would say that it went OK, but there are certainly a lot of buttons to click and boxes to tick!! Anyway I have a couple of questions.

1. The trainer made the point that you don't need to draw things accurately as you can always adjust them later. To me this is just wrong and doesn't make sence. Surely if the information drawn correctly in the first place this will save time having to change it later.

2. There appears to be no way in revit to dimension the width between handrails to a staircase. The example we used was a curved staircase. Is this really the case it a program that costs £4.5k?

3. Also found out that if you delete the handrails to a staircase there is no way of re-drawing these. Is this right?

Any thoughts/comments apprecieted.

[greg.mcdowell]

1 - Model as accurately as you understand at the time knowing you can always revisit items later as you learn more about the design.
2 - No, particularly not on a curved stair.
3 - No, you can recreate handrails if/when you delete them.

[stuartw]

1 - Model as accurately as you understand at the time knowing you can always revisit items later as you learn more about the design..

Noted.


- No, particularly not on a curved stair..

Why not? Surely you must be able to do this. How do you get this information into the design so that the stairs/handrails can be fabricated correctly?


- No, you can recreate handrails if/when you delete them.

OK. thanks. Wonder why I was told I couldn't do this? I will check this on my next training day.

[Revitaoist]

1. I sometimes model things very fast just to get the massing of the building done and the windows and doors in place. People are very impressed when they see the building in 3D, and they don't know it's only 80-90% accurate. It's easy to fine tune things if you know what you're doing.

2. You can dimension between handrails on stairs, but you cannot put a linear dimension on an arc, you have to put a radial dimension on there, which only gives you a radius, not the dist. between rails.

3. You can redraw the handrails on stairs once you delete them. Edit the handrail and you will see it is just a sketch line. The difference is that the handrails that are sketched in the stair when you create it have their height set to 'by host', which puts their height relative to the stair. You can change a default handrail to the same.

My 2 cents: Most 'trainers' and teachers don't know much about revit, if they did, they would be working in the industry. You need to take initiative to learn the software. Watch tutorials on youtube, check on here for the latest posts and issues people are facing and solving. It's well worth the money if you work in construction and architecture.

[Revitaoist]

Here's proof of dimensions on handrails!!!

[mthurnauer]

1) This type of comment often pertains to things like you don;t need to know exactly what the construction of a wall is early on, just make it generic and fine tune it later. It is nice to work accurately early on, but as stated, you can always pick and object and then click in the temporary dimensions later and make them true clean dimensions. It is important to type in the true dimensions verses run a string of dimensions and see that they may appear clean because your dimension tolerance may be set to an 1/8", but when you click on the temporary dimensions you discover that something is off to x/256" and these errors can compound.

2) Dimensioning to handrails can be strange, but an important point to note is that most codes for clearance requirements are not the distance between handrails, but the stair itself. The code then states how much an obstruction can protrude into the required clearance (usually 4-1/2" per side). The one exception is when some stairs must have a min of 48" clear between rails to be able to carry a stretcher down them. Rather than fighting this, I would dimension the stair in plan and dimension the distance of the handrail off of the wall or guardrail in a detail or section.

3) yes you can redraw the handrails later and I often do. When you draw a handrail later you need to be sure to pick the host. Also note that the line of the handrail or guardrail must be over the stair treads to be hosted by it. For example, if you have a spiral stair and you intend to side-mount a guardrail to it, you will need to set the line on the edge of the stair and then use the offset for the ballusters and handrails, etc. to push it out beyond the edge.

[DaveP]

1. The trainer made the point that you don't need to draw things accurately as you can always adjust them later. To me this is just wrong and doesn't make sence. Surely if the information drawn correctly in the first place this will save time having to change it later.

The key to that statement is the word "need". I teach a class (it's OK, taoist, I have a real job "in the industry", too) and one of the exercises is laying out about a dozen interior walls. I let them struggle through very carefully placing everything exactly in the final location. Takes them about 10 minutes. Then I show them how I can layout it out ballpark in about 30 seconds, and - using the Temporary Dimensions - move them accurately in to place. That takes another 2 minutes. Think of it not as "drawing correctly", but as refining your design.
One other example is that you can lay out your plan using Generic Walls, and later easily change them to the exact Wall Type once that's been determined.


2. There appears to be no way in revit to dimension the width between handrails to a staircase. The example we used was a curved staircase. Is this really the case it a program that costs £4.5k?

In your example, no. But the restriction is not handrails. The thing Revit can't do is dimension between two arcs. It's been on the Wish List for quite a while. Revit can dimension between most things, but they must be parallel to each other. Unfortunately, parallel arcs are the exception.
Frankly, a curved staircase- and dimensioning to it - it a pretty advances topic for day 2 of Revit training.


3. Also found out that if you delete the handrails to a staircase there is no way of re-drawing these. Is this right?

Any thoughts/comments apprecieted.

There's a button right about in the middle of the Home Tab labeled "Railing". That's the tool you need to redraw it.

[jsteinhauer]

Stuart,

Try finding a project out there where walls have not moved, changes in the wall construction, or walls have been deleted. Revit is a very flexible modeling tool. Is it the best thing since sliced bread, no. But give it time and you'll find it very hard to go back to other software packages. There is a thread on here about the progress someone new to Revit experiences, pretty funny. Again, give it time and learn as much as you can. Because, the more you know, the better you'll model. The better you model, the less you have to 'Cheat'. The less you cheat, the easier coordination become. So on, and so forth...

For all the teachers out there. As a project for your students, give them a program for a building, asking them to come up with several different options. Select one of their options, and tell them you want more options based upon 'This one!!! But...'. Once they have come up with the new options, reject them all and go back to one of the other originals. Just before the end of the semester, tell them to stop working on their design, and that you now just want a windowless box with the minimal doors for egress. Call it, welcome to the real world project.

Cheers,
Jeff S.

[Dimitri Harvalias]

My 2 cents: Most 'trainers' and teachers don't know much about revit, if they did, they would be working in the industry. You need to take initiative to learn the software. Watch tutorials on youtube, check on here for the latest posts and issues people are facing and solving. It's well worth the money if you work in construction and architecture.

I see your two cents and I raise you 30 years experience.:lol:
I would agree that there is a big difference in the ability levels of those providing training but the contention that if they were any good at Revit they would be in industry is painting all of us with too broad a brush. I would also agree that a single source of training is no substitute for curiosity, initiative and a desire to understand, not just learn.
Ask your trainer how much industry experience they have and take the time to have a conversation with them prior to bringing them on. You should be able to tell who has 'walked the walk' and who has simply read the manuals and figured out where all the buttons are on the software.
The best trainers and mentors will not only teach you how to work the software but how to make the software work.:beer:

[ajayholland]

The best trainers and mentors will not only teach you how to work the software but how to make the software work.:beer:
Very well said Dimitri
~AJH

[Dimitri Harvalias]

Why thank you Mr. Holland. The best are also more eloquenter and can talk more better than those who are more worser :lol:

[stuartw]

Thanks to all your responses. Interesting reading.

Just had day 3 of training, but that's another thread.