Reference Plane as Work Plane

[gdb]

I am having trouble usign a reference plane as a work plane. I am using named reference planes to help me position diagonal unistrut bracing (needed for MEP coordination). I have done this with a couple of braces successfully. However, now when I name the plane and place the component the component won't move exactly with the reference plane. Just a slight rotation causes the component to go way out of the view. I attached a short screen recording to illustrate the problem. I'm not sure what changed or what I did differently for the first two. Has anyone encountered this. before.

[dlpdi5b]

Maybe try attaching your file as an RFA instead of a swf and we can look at it. It shouldn't be any problem to align and lock your strut to a named ref plane. if it is an angled constraint, you probably want to use a reference LINE, not a reference plane. then you can adjust the angle using a parameter.

The two methods to connect geometry to a ref plan or ref line are to
A: use the align tool and then lock the padlock icon, or
B: use dimensions between the geometry and the ref plane, and lock those.

To better see what is happening when things move unexpectedly, go into View Graphics, Annotation Categories, and then turn on Automatic Sketch Dimensions.

[gdb]

I attached the rvt file. The issue isn't in the family. I am trying to place the unistrut bracing on a named reference plane (45_3) as the workplane and rotate the reference plane 45 degrees. It worked on the first two, but I'm not sure why I am having trouble proceeding with this technique. When I rotate this one it moves on the reference plane. The applicable views are open in the file when you open it. Try looking at the first two (braces attached to 45_1 and 45_2) and move them around and rotate etc. then try the third. I get different results. Let me know if you have any luck. I can't figure out what I am doing different that this isn't working as it had before.

[Mike Sealander]

It looks like you drew ref plane 45_1 and 45_2 while in section, which is why you can rotate them in section. It looks like 45_3 was drawn in plan, which is why you can't rotate in section.
Looking at your model, I would create a new family made with nested unistrut families representing the vertical AND the diagonal unistruts. If you make a unistrut with its length an instance parameter, you can control the length within the "nest" family. You can also use reference lines, as mentioned above, to control the nested unistrut's angle. Then all you have to do is plop this unistrut assembly in place where your P5001 struts are in the project.

[gdb]

Mike,

In that model I did draw ref plane 45_3 in plan. However, I just tested with another ref plane drawn in section, 45_4 and I am having the same results. I do like your idea of nesting that family in a different family. It makes sense since I am going to have many versions of similar bracing in the model. I was going to group, but I think I will give the family a shot. I would still like to figure out why I am having issues with the bracing associated to a ref plane in the model. I'm sure this won't be the last time I come across this issue so it would be nice to know what is going on.

[Mike Sealander]

Check to make sure Place on Vertical or some other unwanted switch is not checked as you place your unistrut. Other than that, it's usually faster to delete a ref plane or whatever else is giving you trouble and start again. Also, you didn't by chance make two unistruts, one with Always Vertical turned on in the family creation?

[gdb]

It turns out building this bracing in a family, nesting the unistrut in an overall bracing family with angle control etc, was the thing to do. Mike, that was your recommendation I just didn't know exactly how to do it. I was having the same problem in the family editor trying to work with bracing attached to an angled reference plane. I saw online using reference lines is recommended. I also received this response from Autodesk support:

I understand when you rotate a reference plane, the elements hosted to it, move to unexpected locations.

If you want to rotate reference planes, it is best to draw them in section and not plan. I would make sure the reference plane in question was drawn in section.

I would then nest the family and then use rotational parameters to control the angle of the family.

The following blog posts have steps for doing this:

Rotational Parameters in a Conceptual Mass Family
http://revitclinic.typepad.com/my_weblog/2010/10/rotational-parameters-in-a-conceptual-mass-family.html

Rotational Parameters and Face-Based Nested Families
http://revitclinic.typepad.com/my_weblog/2009/05/rotational-parameters-and-facebased-nested-families.html


As I said, I didn't have good luck using reference planes in section even in the family editor, but I used reference lines as shown in the second video and that worked great. The videos were a big help. Thank you for the replies.