Question about inserted blocks

[Curt340924]

After searching and experimenting for hours, it looks like there is no way to manipulate an inserted block with unequal x & y scale factors. There does not seem to be a way to offset, trim, extend, divide or join objects to such a block. Furthermore, if the inserted block (which consists of a egg-shaped open polyline) is exploded, it cannot be converted into new polyline that would allow manipulation; ACAD 2010 tells me it is invalid, or that it can't do something with the object. There does not seem to be a way to add objects to the original and assemble into a single new object.

Am I missing something, or will I have to live with the situation?

It seems like there should be a way to apply independent scale factors for x & y and then use the result to build a new object.

[heinsite]

First, are you certain that your block was created with the ability to explode it? Check that first. Type BLOCK and look to see if Allow exploding is checked. If not, check it, save the block and try again.

You can't offset a block in any version as far as I know, but I was able to trim to a block and explode a block that had been inserted at non-uniform scales.

If you continue to have problems, upload the block so we can look at it.

Dave

[arshiel88]

After searching and experimenting for hours, it looks like there is no way to manipulate an inserted block with unequal x & y scale factors. There does not seem to be a way to offset, trim, extend, divide or join objects to such a block. Furthermore, if the inserted block (which consists of a egg-shaped open polyline) is exploded, it cannot be converted into new polyline that would allow manipulation; ACAD 2010 tells me it is invalid, or that it can't do something with the object. There does not seem to be a way to add objects to the original and assemble into a single new object.

Am I missing something, or will I have to live with the situation?

It seems like there should be a way to apply independent scale factors for x & y and then use the result to build a new object.

1. One way to manipulate a block's x,y, and z scale factors is thru the Properties panel.
2. You can use objects inside the block as trimming boundary but the other operations you mentioned needs block editing, REFEDIT & BEDIT command.
3. How did you came up with the "egg-shaped open polyline"? Is it a product of exploding a non-uniformly scaled block?

[ccowgill]

If you start with a polyline, I'm almost positive it will convert it to a spline when you explode the non uniform scaled block. You would then have to convert the spline to a polyline, but it still would not be simple to modify as you would have a lot of verticies.

[clshade]

I've always needed to add a line to Trim to if the Block is non uniform X & Y.
A square being revised to a rectangle thru the X & Y for example.

[Curt340924]

Thanks to heinsite, arshiel88, and ccowgill - I have tried each suggestion. Here are my results:
A. Checking the "explode" vox also checks the "uniform scale" box. I need non-uniform scales.
B. The properties panel will not allow me to make x & y scales different.
C. The original block is a splined polyline. The inserted block does not allow conversion to a spline (or at least I couldn't do it.)

Still not getting an inserted block to allow manipulation.

I have attached the file I am using for a block.

Its origin is the right half of a layer in a laminated nose for a scale model airplane. The original was traced from a printed drawing of the full size airplane, and converted to a splined polyline. In creating the splined version, the number of vertices increased to over 200. The non-uniform x & y scale factors are required to make the laminations conform to vertical and horizontal shapes. FWIW, the laminations are composed of right and left halves because the structure of the fuselage uses a keel which determines the shape of the fuselage when viewed from the side.

[ccowgill]

to extend or trim, try using the express tools for such a command
bextend and btrim
if you explode a non uniformly scaled block, it will revert to original geometry, the splined polyline will turn into multiple line segments, which seem to have little gaps. using the old express/bonus tool pljoin, with a fuzz gap of .001 I was able to reconstitute a polyline, but there is no way to reconvert that to a spline. Once the object has been changed back into a single polyline, you can use regular commands on it such as extend, trim, explode, offset, etc.

[clshade]

First I created a BLOCK of your shape. Named TEST
Set Yes to allow exploding
Set No to Scale Uniformly
INSERT the block into Modelspace
All good and no problem.

A. Did not happen while in the BE here.
B. This function worked as well in Modelspace here
C. After Explosion I ran PEDIT, Selected all, Join, Fuzz distance to .5 and rejoined the previous block that had been set to an unequal X & Y

But to your original query: I may have done what you seek if I understod what you were looking for.

[Curt340924]

to extend or trim, try using the express tools for such a command
bextend and btrim
if you explode a non uniformly scaled block, it will revert to original geometry, the splined polyline will turn into multiple line segments, which seem to have little gaps. using the old express/bonus tool pljoin, with a fuzz gap of .001 I was able to reconstitute a polyline, but there is no way to reconvert that to a spline. Once the object has been changed back into a single polyline, you can use regular commands on it such as extend, trim, explode, offset, etc.

I am by no means an AutoCAD expert - in fact, I am much like a private pilot with 300 hours - I can fly, but I am likely a danger to myself and others.

However, I am learning a lot about ACAD in this project, including my latest lesson - how to use fuzz. When I exploded the original block, it retained the uneven scale factors (I can't explain why). When I reconstructed the polyline, using a suitable fuzz factor, I was able to trim, offset and join it to other objects. I don't need to apply a spline conversion, since the line segments are short enough for my purposes..

So - bottom line: I am off and running again. But knowing me, I will be back with more questions in the future.

Thanks!!!

[Curt340924]

First I created a BLOCK of your shape. Named TEST
Set Yes to allow exploding
Set No to Scale Uniformly
INSERT the block into Modelspace
All good and no problem.

A. Did not happen while in the BE here.
B. This function worked as well in Modelspace here
C. After Explosion I ran PEDIT, Selected all, Join, Fuzz distance to .5 and rejoined the previous block that had been set to an unequal X & Y

But to your original query: I may have done what you seek if I understod what you were looking for.

CLSHADE: As you can see in my previous post to CCOWGILL, my problem has been solved - thanks to you both.

However, I could not simultaneously "set explode to yes" AND set "no to scale uniformity". AutoCAD would not allow such a combination. However, per your description, (A,B,C) my problem is solved.

Thanks!!

[clshade]

Is Annotative set to NO in that dialog?

[ccowgill]

So - bottom line: I am off and running again. But knowing me, I will be back with more questions in the future.

Thanks!!!
No Problem, that's why we are here.