Back To Back Mullions on Storefront - how do i do it?

[bwilliams133]

A little background: we are creating a large expanse of "curved" storefront. The manufacturer has provided a revit model with the correct series we're using, but it only comes with the standard vertical mullions where the glass is intersecting on both sides. Not the mullion the rep recommended which only has glass intersecting on one said. The representative has indicated we should use a segmented wall with back to back mullions and use break metal to cover the slight gap between the mullions. The client is interesting, and based on previous comments wants to see everything correctly on the drawings. In other words, he was thrown off when we used different hatch patterns to indicate two different tiles, he thought that was the actual tile we were showing and started to get pretty upset over it. So we need to make sure to show him the storefront accurately.

Is there a way to add a second mullion easily and have it placed back to back with the other one WHILE keeping my correct glass distance? I'm thinking that my best bet at this point is to draw each segment separately. Let me know if anyone has other suggestions. Thanks!

[damon.sidel]

I'm sure there is a way, but I'm not sure I understand what you want. Could you post a quick sketch?
What I'm thinking is that instead of thinking of them as two profiles, make them one profile with a connection. See attached image.

92551

[Dimitri Harvalias]

As Damon suggested. Define the outer profile of the completed back to back mullion and then add detail components (only if needed at this stage IMHO) to the profile family for added detail. In 3D views it will look as it's supposed to and it will be way easier to manage from a modeling standpoint.

[bwilliams133]

Sorry, AUGI has never allowed me to post photos/sketches. I've tried numerous times and contacted people about it, so I'll have to do better with words.

What's you've drawn is pretty darn close to what I'm trying to accomplish. Here's what I've been doing since I posted the question. Changed the standard mullion (keep in mind, I'm using a manufacturer's revit storefront, not the out of the box), to the end mullion (either right or left). Then I insert another grid line next to it and change that mullion to the opposite end and move it til it is right next to the first mullion, so now it is close to the correct shape in plan. I had to figure out the correct spacing I needed in order to get my 4'-0' glass distance. When I draw my detail of the connection, I'm just going to have to hide the frames and draft over it correctly since it's not 100% correct. That's going to be the only issue, otherwise it's close enough in plan and elevation that is should satisfy the client and get the general idea across. The only snag I just hit is I got an error message that said something to the effect of multiple dominant mullions may create ambiguities....or something close to that.

All that said, I would just draw a new profile, but I couldn't figure out how to do it. So if you can walk me down that path, maybe that would be easier. Thanks.

[damon.sidel]

Pretty simple in terms of drawing it. Getting the offsets the way you want is the tricky part.

1. Create a New family > Profile-Mullion
2. Draw lines that define one closed boundary to show what you want. It has to be one closed boundary.
3. Save it where you need it.
4. Load it into your project.
5. Create a new mullion (in your project browser go to Families > Curtain Wall Mullion, Right-Click the Rectangular Mullion to create new) and use your new profile in that family.
6. Use it in your curtain wall.

If I haven't been clear enough, I'm sure there is a YouTube video on how to create custom mullions in Revit. :)

[patricks]

Why not just use the OOTB L-corner mullion? Then in a detail view show it with whatever break metal you would use. That should be a standard detail anyway for most any curtain wall or storefront manufacturer.

[Dimitri Harvalias]

Patricks,
Correct me if I'm wrong but I thought corner mullions are only available at the end of a curtain wall and can't be used as an interior mullion in a pre-defined system.

[patricks]

If the curtain wall is "curved" i.e. segmented, then each segment will be a separate piece of wall, in which a corner mullion can go at the intersection of each segment.

*edit* just checked and yes, even on a system with a pre-defined layout, which automatically segments the wall if you draw it as a curve, you can still use the corner mullions on those interior segment "break" points.