Levels mystery

[squidly]

i have a linked model to the main model i'm working in, which is an existing conditions model with all the existing levels in it. i performed an exercise yesterday renaming levels in both models so as to agree across the project. Following this, i noticed that i could no longer see the second level plan. After much searching, i found that there is a second level existing below my first level, but with the same name as the second level that's in the correct place (above the first level). i couldn't see the level 2 plan because the view range was screwed to a level below my first floor. What the hell? Anyway, i can't see the second level that's below the first level, but i know it exists because if i draw a wall associated to "Second Level", it shows "underground". If you're still following this, you're good.

So, among many questions, is this: How would i have been permitted to make 2 levels with identical names? Why is the default level position the one that's not viewable, but when i want to make a plan view of this level, it does so from the correct level (the one above the first level)? i haven't found a way to make the underground level 2 visible, despite making elevations that should show all. Does anyone have any suggestions on how i might fix this? i can't delete the underground level 2 as there are over 300 items associated with it.

[dhurtubise]

My guess is that you have a spelling difference, like level or Level for example.
As for the default position, the level could have been drawn above level 1 then drag below level 2 maybe.

You could Cut / Paste all the elements from the undergraound level to the proper one.

[squidly]

i tried to cut and paste the rooms associated with this level to the correct level, but instead more were added to the level. This is all very mystifying, but i assume something very basic is wrong, i just can't find out what it is.

[Steve_Stafford]

How about a screen capture of a section that shows these levels. Have 2014? You can use it to create a schedule of levels to see what gets reported.

[squidly]

Steve, i can't see the levels. i bought an add-in that allowed me to select all items on the levels and re-assign them to other levels, but still i have these levels in the model but with no way to delete them or even to see them. Crop view is unchecked, far clipping without line, you name it i can't find a way to get these out of the model. i want them out so that others can't use them, which they're likely to do as they're named just as the desired levels are named. Is there no way to purge a level with no associations?

i have 2013, so i can't use the scheduling tool.

[MikeJarosz]

Steve, i can't see the levels.

If you created your new file using the Revit default template, you got Level 1 and Level 2 as floor plans. That's all you get! From there you are on your own. If you create new levels, correct or incorrect, floor plan views will not automatically appear in the browser. You have to create plan views yourself. My guess is you cannot see the incorrect level in plan because you never created a view for it. Go to the view tab/plan view/floor plan The window will show levels that do not have plan views associated with them. You can create one in that window.

Also, keep in mind you cannot delete a level if it has anything on it.

[squidly]

Thanks Mike.

i've created plans at those levels; that's how i found out i had a problem in the first place. But i'll bet you're right that the origin of the incorrect levels is the default levels, because when i brought in the linked model i had to lift it to the correct height (not 0'-0"), and i used copy monitor to create the new (correct) levels. So now the question is how can i get rid of the two incorrect levels? i'd be happy with renaming them, but since i can't see them i can't do that or even delete them. i've tried all the tricks i can search for to see them, but to no avail. Maybe you know some others?

[Steve_Stafford]

Right click on a level you can see, choose Select All Instances > in entire Project (how many are selected) and then right click again, choose Maximize 3D Extents. Do you see the level now?

[dhurtubise]

Recreate the EXACT same level, you will get a warning that it already exist but most importantly you will get an ID. Use that ID to select the missing level

[squidly]

Steve, that did the trick. Thanks much!

[MikeJarosz]

This is one of the more annoying problems in Revit: extraneous levels. On my projects I do not allow levels to be created for anything that can't be walked on. I have seen levels created for "top of parapet" "roof ridge" and other points that are best indicated by spot elevations or a named reference plane.

Then there are the naming variations: Level 3, Third Floor, Floor 3, etc. I always use Level 1, Level 2 etc. It's the Revit default and I see no reason not to use it.

[squidly]

You wouldn't be happy working on my current project. We're renovating an old, large airport terminal with more levels than you can imagine, with more added by the structural engineers for their top of steel elevations. Some projects are of a complexity that won't allow for Level 1, Level 2, etc., as some of the levels are extensive, so needing names, but only a few feet apart in height.

By the way, you were correct that the incorrect levels were the result of the 2 default levels that come with a new project file. We named them, but after the linked model was brought in and copy monitored and raised to the correct height, we forgot about the old, useless levels yet the names remained and people used them, not knowing that their items were being placed on an absent level.

[MikeJarosz]

I have done several airports including Toronto-Pearson and JFK-Terminal 4. When we have ramps and multiple elevations only a few feet apart I name them by elevation: "Level 354.5", "Level 360.0" and so on.

My remark about variant level names is the result of hard experience with consulting engineers. Here is an analysis I did of level names on a Prison I'm working on:

94375

I used this chart to beat them up in a coordination meeting. It's important to understand the culture of many engineering firms. The seniors you deal with daily are not doing the Revit work. The so-called juniors in the back room are doing it all.

The chart was prepared using the Access DB export feature from AD Subscription. The engineers furnish link files that I extracted their levels from. I frequently go directly into their files to tweak things.

[MikeJarosz]

we forgot about the old, useless levels yet the names remained and people used them, not knowing that their items were being placed on an absent level.

This is why I mentioned that you can't delete levels with objects on them. The point about variant names is everybody assumes that Level 3 and Third Floor are the same thing. But some wise guy made Level 3 at +30.25 and someone else made Third Floor at +30.285. And now everybody is using them interchangeably. If you have ever worked in a joint venture you know how this can happen!

[squidly]

Nice idea for naming levels. For the most part we could have done something like that. i like that it has a methodology to it so that someone can name a level without coming up with some strange name that no one else has a clue to. The chart is also useful, though we've taken the lead in naming levels through file sharing. Thanks