Multiple phase filter styles?

[damon.sidel]

I'm getting comments about my demo plans (from our government agency client) to "improve line weights for readability". I'm using industry standards for my plans.

On my demo plans: existing-to-remain is solid, gray, medium lines; demolished is dashed, black, medium lines.

On my proposed plans: existing-to-remain is solid, gray, medium lines; new is black lines that follow object styles and walls have a medium gray, solid fill pattern.

I have seen demo plans with existing-to-remain walls as solid medium-gray lines with solid light-gray fill pattern. I was going to try that. However, to do that, I would have to change my Existing Phase filter Cut Pattern, which would affect both the ETR walls in the demo plans and the ETR walls in the proposed plans.

Is there a way achieve a fill pattern in my ETR walls in demo plans and NOT in the proposed plans (just solid fill new walls in proposed plans)?

[patricks]

I was going to suggest a filter applied in a view template, but it doesn't look like objects can have a filter based on phase created and demolished. Would love to hear other suggestions.

[BillB_UH92]

Hi Damon

In phasing menu:
Floor plan ("Show Complete" in phase filter): New construction is by Category [use Graphic Override or View Settings to make all walls whatever hatch you like, the exception will be whatever is over ridden per your phase filter - your ETR] ETR is by the Phasing menu.
Demo Plan ("Show Previous (ETR) and Demo" in phase filter): ETR is by category [Graphic Override or View Settings to make whatever you like for that view] and demo walls are according to Phasing menu.
This allows different ETR in demo and floor plans.

The Phase Menu will override the other settings as long as that phase is set to "Overridden" not "By Category" in the middle tab of the Phasing menu ("Phase Filters").

Please let me know if it does not work, it works for me at least....

Cheers

[BillB_UH92]

104126
Here (Hopefully) is screen shot of the Phasing Menu

[damon.sidel]

Floor plan ("Show Complete" in phase filter): New construction is by Category [use Graphic Override or View Settings to make all walls whatever hatch you like, the exception will be whatever is over ridden per your phase filter - your ETR] ETR is by the Phasing menu.

Is there a reason you use "Show Complete" rather than "Show Previous + New" for your proposed plans? "Complete" to me means showing everything that will be done at the end of the phase as all the same graphic style. I think it might be semantics, but just wanted to know if you had other reasons. Your "Show Complete" and "Show Previous + New" filter are the same in your PDF.

So I took your advice and tried it (using the "Show Previous + New" for my proposed plans, rather than "Show Complete", but the filter is the same as yours). I'm still using the same Phase Filter, set up the same way as I had it and the same way you have it, for my proposed plans. The proposed plans were fine, so that is good.

In my demo plans, my phase filter is set to "Show Previous + Demo" as I had it before. I changed the settings of that phase filter per your suggestions and the PDF you posted. So everything ETR shows by category. As you note, this allows me to set the style of the ETR objects in my Visibility/Graphics overrides for the view. I'm using a View Template, so I'm able to do it to all my demo plans.

The short of it is, I am able to get the look I want!

The one bummer with this method is that the ETR information in my demo plans is controlled by view templates, not the phase filters. This works just fine, but is not as elegant. I am now feeling that the entire phase filter settings logic is flawed. I think we should be able to make as many phase Graphic Overrides as we want and map them to the Phase Filters. Oh well.

That said, thank you for your suggestion! It gives me the look I need without too much fuss!

[BillB_UH92]

Thanks - Glad it worked.

I was using "complete" instead of "previous and new" only because I had been experimenting with some different settings earlier.
One problem I can not solve: When I put the solid gray fill into the ETR using the Phase Filter, it makes walls (and even floors) all gray in the 3-D views.
(Using the Graphic Overrides or View Settings to make solid gray fill does not have this problem, luckily!)
So I to make my 3-D renderings I have been going into Phase Filters and toggling the ETR to "By Category" until I am done rendering, then put it back on "Overridden" to plot my plans.

If you are making 3-D views from your model, I wanted to let you know...

Also -Attached are 3-D views of that same project with walls gray, then normal after toggling off the Phase Filter. I agree about making the Phase Filters more flexible, more like the other View Settings...
Good luck and have a great day.

[damon.sidel]

I was using "complete" instead of "previous and new" only because I had been experimenting with some different settings earlier. One problem I can not solve: When I put the solid gray fill into the ETR using the Phase Filter, it makes walls (and even floors) all gray in the 3-D views.

Yes, I've noticed that problem. My "Complete" filter has all by category, so I've been using that for my 3d views. Thanks again for your help!

[damon.sidel]

OK, I'm adding to my woes on this one (it may be a case that I have to push back on the "it's the way we've always done it", but bear with me for a moment).

To recap, what I wanted and have accomplished:
On demo plans, we want to show...
...existing to remain (ETR) walls with dark-gray outlines and medium-gray solid fill
...demo walls with black dashed outlines and no fill.

On proposed (new) plans, we want to show...
...existing walls with medium-gray outlines and no fill
...new walls with black continuous outlines and medium-gray solid fill.

The new twist: On proposed wall sections and details, we want to show existing structure (walls, floors, and structure; most is CIP concrete) as black continuous outlines and medium-gray solid fill! (I recognize that this may be confusing, since the plans use that style to represent new construction... I'm a little confused myself how this convention got started.)

On the plans, I only had to worry about new walls, so could give them the solid fill in the view template. On the sections, I need the existing structure to have the override, so have to use a phase filter. However, for phasing, I have already set the graphic overrides to work for the plans. Any thoughts? View Filters can't select per phase.

Working idea: types for all floor, wall, and structure that is existing to remain with a CIP concrete material with a poche hatch; types for all new floors, walls, and structure with a CIP concrete material with the usual concrete hatch. Thoughts?

[BillB_UH92]

Hi Damon

Can you make separate phase filters for your sections & details and another version for your plan view?
You can set "new" and "existing" to whatever you like in each.
(I created special phase filters for my 3-d Views for similar reason)

[damon.sidel]

I tried that, but I'm trying to display stuff that is existing in different ways in different views, so I am limited by the Filter Styles, not the filter.

What I ended up doing, since this was confined primarily to existing concrete structure, is creating a material for existing concrete with the section cut I want. I applied this to all the existing concrete structure (this meant that some floor types now have duplicates, one for existing another for new, even if their composition is the same).

I set all my wall sections and details to "Show Complete" so that all existing structure is represented with the material cut style.

I think the combo of your setup and this material adjustment works well enough for this project. I'm not entirely satisfied with the solution, but it is working!

[david_peterson]

So just a few thoughts here, since what you're tying to do doesn't sound like it's something that Revit thinks of a logical.
I recently had a project that I needed to show multiple phases as new construction while showing the original existing building as halftone.
(I could go on further, but basically I had a project with 17 phases of construction so we could show the step by step areas of construction for the Life Safety Plans, but we were only producing one set of construction drawings. We gutted and remodeled an entire hospital and added a new tower without shutting down any services. It's a giant Jig Saw Puzzle)
So for something things I needed to create separate views (one for each phase of demo) and placed one over the other, so I could show everything that was going to be demo'd on one plan. That's how I solved the multiple demo'd phases on one drawing.
I used the same line of thinking to show existing rooms on a demo plan, since rooms are phase specific. I did similar things to show future work.
Then came the tricky part of showing all of the phases, with the excepting of 2 small areas that were done in a previous contract as an enabling project. So I set everything in my new construction model as Show Complete, Halftoned the Existing model that was linked, and then I added a project parameter that was applied to everything. I went into a 3d view and set the phase to show only the new work for the enabling projects, selected all of the objects and filled out a "Phase" project parameter. Then in my plans I used a view filter (along with the phase filter) to override the phase filter settings.
So as a thought you might want to consider something along that line. If you fill out a parameter (Text or maybe a check box) you can add a view filter to what ever view you want and get it to look how ever you want.
It's a pain, but gives you the most control. I know a lot of MEP groups use this method or separate worksets when it comes to demo work to keep their "systems" intact.
Hope this helps.