Autodesk screws up Revit

[BomberAIA]

I like the way it was before Autodesk bought Revit. Now you have to go thru a dealer that has no clue. I bought Revit for a lifetime, now they tell me I need a subscrption to get updates.($695.00) I paid, they sent me a new CD yesterday w/ new Serial numbers. I tried to install it and I have to remove my other copy. My orgininal copy tells me my subscription is running out and I will be in DEMO mode in 2 days. I called my dealer to find out what was going on, and they don't know. Now I found out you need to reinstall R5.1L if you want Revit to work. What a pain in the %&@#**!!.

[PeterJ]

This last bit is the change over to the AutoDesk License Manager. Revit 6 will enforce adoption of this model, 5.1L also does and is why the download was discussed here. Basically, if you had 5.1 you would have been better advised not to install 5.1L.

The biggest difference I can see in use will be that the ADLM system does not allow a free second license to be carried and used on a remote machine. To achieve this functionality you need to 'check out the license' onto a floppy or a USB drive or similar and then plug it into the separate machine. I'm not sure how this stops you having five machines with a common license, though no doubt it does stop you have five machines on a network with a common license.

[Martin P]

Ohh no!!!!! that system is really cr@p... we got autocad 2004 recently and its the same thing. A real pain in the back side as you have to know you are going to need it in advance at home. What I dont understand is why you cant just check your license out from an autodesk website every time you use revit?? that way you dont need to mess about carrying a "key" with you, which is easy to forget - either way - say you get to work after the weekend and forget to take it back? I know I am going to do this.... absolutely the worst possible system I can imagine, if it aint broke dont fix it!




hmmmmm... maybe I overstated it a bit :oops: It wont end the world for me but... problem is at the moment I have Revit at home - and I have it at work, I like it that way as I can just decide on the spur of the moment to do work if I feel like it... Dont think America used "dongles" for Autocad? but we had these things you had to plug into the printer port in the back of your pc to make autocad work... if you wanted to work at home you had to unplug the dongle, take it home, plug it in - and vice versa.... I had several occasions where I had to go back home on a monday to retrieve a dongle I had forgotten about :oops: I am just sad that to be going back to using dongles :cry: although you couldnt email those ones to yourself!!

Maybe it wont be so bad.....

- and errr it was an invalid session with the first post :?

[PeterJ]

Invalid session problem, Martin or are you simply so enraged you felt the need to reply twice?

[Solomon]

While I certainly feel your pain: hoping there are no snags in the new licensing scheme (but unfortunately expecting some,) and the frustration of resellers who know nothing about Revit, as well as liking Revit in the pre-Autodesk days - I think that we couldn't have expected it to continue as it was.

We have to remember that Revit was trying to gain a foothold in an Autodesk world. How many ADT users are still reluctant to look at Revit, even considering that Autodesk continues to tell us that Revit is its future architectural platform and is available through the same reseller that sells ADT? Lots. Months before Revit was acquired by Autodesk, it received additional funding from its venture capitalists & laid some people off. Although a great product - it wasn't selling, and who knows how much longer it could have lasted.

So, we can believe that Revit sold us out by allowing Autodesk to acquire them, but if you were given a choice of Revit stopping development at 4.0 because it went under, or continuing to develop under the widely distributed (though certainly bureacratic) Autodesk reseller market - I'm gonna have to go with Revit 6.0, even considering all of the Autodesk baggage that it brings.

I don't want to sound like I'm disagreeing too strongly - there are definitely countless things to hate about Autodesk - but at least we still have the original Revit team continuing to guide its progress...

Solomon

[Steve_Stafford]

Some 18 months ago I was lamenting the fact that I could check out a license with Bentley products and not Autodesk. Now we can...took some time but the alternative was NOT.

It wasn't even the Globetrotter FlexLM application preventing it before, just how/what Autodesk licensed and/or implemented at the time. (at least that's my understanding)

Anyway, this may be new and frustrating for long time Revit users, but "on balance" it is actually an improvement for those of us with large numbers of users and other Autodesk software. Since we are "used" to it, this is no "biggie". But I sympathize with those of you suffering... :cry:

[Wes Macaulay]

Many of our users up here have been asking for something just like this. When people buy new computers, they couldn't get their Revit licenses running - but with the new license utility people can transfer the license readily to the new computer.

Getting used to the new system (as I had to do - I've never used this system before now) isn't hard at all. I'm a big fan of network licensing and with the ability to check out a license and take it on the road... I mean, that's great!

With regards to Autodesk I note two things: their need to impress shareholders (who have no interest in Revit), and their need to follow all the rules for public companies in the U.S. Autodesk isn't trying to abuse their user base so much as make their stock look attractive. These are not necessarily compatible purposes.

I also note the ignorance of resellers in getting Revit into the hands of architects. Having just read the BB's for ArchiCAD and Vectorworks again, and having attended some ADT classes at AU, I don't get why Revit isn't FLYING off the virtual shelves! And you can bet the resellers aren't helping enough. Arggh.

[hand471037]

I think things may be changing on the Reseller front. Revit changes a lot, it changes the role of the staff within the office as well as the role of the resellers. The best resellers out there will adapt, and become more like high-end car dealerships, where selling you the car is just one of the many things they do; they will also show you how to fix it, how to drive it, and will modify it for you to suit your needs and taste. Not to sound cheesy, but they are selling *solutions*, not just cars and parts. The ones who are still just trying to sell you an incomplete car, car parts, add-ons, and things like 'underbody protective coatings' :) ala Fargo will eventually die out and fail to the other firms.

Just like those smaller Architecture firms stuck in 'flatland' ;) are gonna have a hard time keeping up with the Revit/ArchiCAD firms, both in quality and quanity, while also having larger overhead supporting that CAD Lisp programmer and in-house 'customization'.

I think we're in a shift as big right now as the shift from hand-drafting to flat CAD. That's gonna effect everyone in the market eventually, whether they are aware of it coming or not (shareholders).

[ajayholland]

I think we're in a shift as big right now as the shift from hand-drafting to flat CAD. That's gonna effect everyone in the market eventually, whether they are aware of it coming or not (shareholders).

A year ago some were predicting that the transition might take a decade. I think that estimate can now be reduced. Let's hope it's quick, because it probably won't be painless.

-AJH

[hand471037]

I think you're right in that it won't be painless. :)

However I still know firms that are mixing hand-drafting with CAD; plans on CAD, details by Hand... So that ten year number might not be far off. :)

[PeterJ]

I read an article today that suggested that the big resistance to BIM, whatever flavour, is that we need to produce 2D stuff for the people who implement the proposals, i.e. the Contractors. So for many many many people the 2D drafting style seemed ideal. It was also noted that all the BIm solutions available at present require some post-processing of modelled information to provide the familiar ideal of drawing sheets and that that led to potential user error. I have, on occasion, let a drawing out with something showing wrongly in section where it was alterd on plan or in elevation, even if it as simple as location of a text leader it could still be costly.

The real shift will be as Contractors get smarter and demand a better quality of information that they can more effectively query. I spoke recently with an employee of a major Contractor here (with turnover approaching $1 billion per annum you get a feel for the size and complexity of contracts they work on) who said that on the majority of tenders they enter they still do not get a single electronic document.

Until contractors demand more, or perhaps just get more, there will be a slow gradient in the increase of people using BIM products to really work their information, not using ADT becasue it has more blocks for standard doors. When the remainder of the industry gets involved then there will be an explosion becasue other disciplines (HVAC, Electrical Engineer's, Structural Engineers as well as the Contractors) will all start to see that they can leverage more from the model.

[hand471037]

I get a call every other week from someone at a local large design-build company looking for more info on Revit.

No foolin'.

I think we're in for a rather messy time. After all, it was the rest of the market that dragged Architects into CAD, kicking and screaming along the way. I think the same thing will happen with BIM; the large clients will require it, the smart firms will jump on it, and everyone else will just get screwed. :)

What I mean is that most Architects don't want to understand than there role is changing in the construction industry, and as such aren't willing to grab a hold of some of the new opertunitys that arise leaving others to pick up that slack. They just want to bury thier heads in the sand.

[beegee]

With regards to Autodesk I note two things: their need to impress shareholders (who have no interest in Revit), and their need to follow all the rules for public companies in the U.S. Autodesk isn't trying to abuse their user base so much as make their stock look attractive. These are not necessarily compatible purposes.

Hmmm, If I was investing in a company, I'd be looking closely at the fundamentals and the technicals, but would I care how they licensed their product ? , (as long as it was legal ).

[designer56644]

Ineteresting topic...(soapbox warning)

In my neck of the woods (the wild west), residential and light commercial construction is going nuts. And finally, the general contractors are waking up to the fact that highly accurate, quality cd's SAVE THEM MONEY!... Duh%$^&*(DAMMIT!!!!!)

I know that may seem off the wall to state now, but highly accurate docs are the key, and can only be produced under tight production schedules using highly skilled techs who understand highly accurate drafting solutions. Like so many things in the business world these days, our futures WILL BE based on the qualitative quantity of work we can produce. Under these circumstances, I cannot see how building modeling softwares cannot succeed and blow the error prone, cross check monster flatlanders away (thats' right Djiordje:))

Therefore, it only follows that the "changes" being refered to in this thread are going to accelerate. Whether it's Revit, Archicad, Ecotech or whatever, it's happening now, as we cogitate, too late to put the milk back in the udder. It's the nature if change, and if you can't, then you better get out of the way.

We'll adjust to the uncomfortable license schema's and disconcerting changes imposed upon our level of comfort, or we'll switch to another contender. It's what people who are willing to place their money and faith in leading technologies do <:).

So smile big and enjoy the ride boys and girls;
We're in the vanguard.