Beam System Question

[olson]

Ok, so i placed a beam system for a set of roof beams and cannot get the first and last beam to show up. Also would i put in an in place fam for the decking then attach the walls to the decking. i dont really want to use a roof.

[Rhythmick]

You can edit the beam system and move the side sketch lines out enough to add a beam to each side, finish the sketch, then align (or move) the end beams where needed.

EDIT: easier yet, you can copy a beam from the system and move it to the ends.

Not sure why you would not want to use the roof tool for the sheating, just set the roof properties for the sheating only. The sheating elevation can be easily set on top of the beams by moving the roof from a section or elevation view.

[Paul Andersen]

Unless there is a workaround out there, I'm pretty sure the end members can not be a part of the beam system. The beam system is generally used for the infill beams only, with the supporting members and end members already in place. I'm guessing this was done for several reasons. The infill members on most framing systems are generally somewhat consistent and can be copied from bay to bay while keeping the primary members independent. Also since the direction of the beam system can be changed, if the end beams were included they could wind up overlapping the original supporting members. You could also run into end beam overlap when placing beam systems adjacent to each other.

That all being said it would be nice to have an end beam toggle to either show/include them or not.

As a side note I currently only use the beam system with fixed number for the layout rule. Fixed Distance is nice to have but I've yet to put it to any real use and I believe the Maximum Spacing (which would be very useful) to be flawed. For example a hypothetical 20'-0" bay with Maximum Spacing set to 8'-0" produces 3 infill members spaced at 5'-0" when I believe it should be 2 infill members spaced at 6'-8". I have logged this issue with support.

If adding the end beams in seperately doesn't work well for your situation perhaps an array might do the trick.

[Paul Andersen]

You can edit the beam system and move the side sketch lines out enough to add a beam to each side, finish the sketch, then align (or move) the end beams where needed.There's one workaround. Thanks Rhythmick. I generally use the beam system to keep my spacing intact during all the grid line shifts that we typically encounter throughout the course of a project and generally don't re-space them manually.

Now that I think of it though another similar approach would be to draw the beam system sketch to it's normal extents and if you need 6 infill members and 2 end members set the system to fixed number 8 and then unpin and re-space the beams as necessary. This does defeat the purpose of the spacing but would produce a beam system with the desired effect.

I still think a simple toggle to add the end members would be the cleanest solution.


EDIT: easier yet, you can copy a beam from the system and move it to the ends.
Another good one. Guess I've got to learn to type faster ;) .

[Rhythmick]

That all being said it would be nice to have an end beam toggle to either show/include them or not.

I would like to assign properties to the sketch lines - select and make it a rim joist, beam or ?

[sbrown]

I just make the beam system 2 bays wider than it really is.

[Paul Andersen]

I would like to assign properties to the sketch lines - select and make it a rim joist, beam or ?That would be pretty slick as long as the sketch lines could be set to none as well for using the beam system purely for infill purposes.

I'm also officially retiring the phrase "Unless there is a workaround out there . . . " In the time it took to type a reply not 1 but 2 workarounds appeared. This site never ceases to amaze me.

[olson]

Thanks guys, i will give that a try.

[iru69]

I'm also officially retiring the phrase "Unless there is a workaround out there . . . " In the time it took to type a reply not 1 but 2 workarounds appeared. This site never ceases to amaze me.

Main Entry: work·a·round
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English werk, work, from Old English werc, weorc; akin to Old High German werc work, Greek ergon, Avestan var&zem activity + Middle English, from Old French roont, from Latin rotundus

workaround - A temporary kluge used to bypass, mask or otherwise avoid a bug or misfeature in some system. Customers often find themselves living with workarounds for long periods of time rather than getting a bug fix.

There's a fine line between "flexibility" and "broken". I too am amazed at how inventive users can be in coming up with "workarounds". However, I'm also amazed at how many "workarounds" are necessary to complete even the most basic of tasks in Revit. Let's not let the Factory lose sight of that.

[Steve_Stafford]

oh no another apologist replying...sorry... :smile:

My understanding of the beam system, it is to represent the secondary members in the structural system, purlins etc. So these systems do not include the major supporting perimeter elements they are framed into. The system is intended to be supported by this perimeter structure. The chicken and the egg sort of.

Since Revit Structure's primary influence so far has been steel framed and concrete buildings the command is based on that use. It sounds like you are interested in using it (for wood structure) to define the perimeter structure as well as the interior you are stepping outside the original intent of the tool.

I'm sure they are able to accomodate more ideas about how to help your work flow, but it sounds like a slightly different version of the existing tool. Add your voice(s) to the wishlist and contact support so they understand your needs.

[Tom Weir]

Hi all,
I agree with Paul and Steve that the beam system is primarily intended for in-fills and not members connecting to columns.
Remember that for those members you can enable the grid option and thus easily place them throughout your framing plan.
This also reflects how the building will be constructed in the field, i.e girders and then beam in-fills.
Like Paul I am also frustrated that the maximum spacing parameter does not work correctly.

Have a great day...

Tom Weir
Los Angeles

[olson]

here is the model. i am trying to place tjis and sheetrock between the beams and have the sheathing on the top. also i want the beams to be exposed outside and just see the decking. thats why i wanted to use in place fams.

[Rhythmick]

So my thinking that the beam tool was also a starting point to be improved upon for those needing framing tools is self serving denial? As well traveled as this subject is, I will remain in focus and keep the faith that it is still coming. :)