Copied Ceiling Object problems

[Griff]

I have had this problem before but have never figured out a fix other than adding new objects, which takes too much time.

I have a new 2'x2' ceiling grid. I am placing new 2'x4' lights in the ceiling. This works fine but if I take that 2'x4' light I just placed and copy it (which is much faster than placing new ones) the ceiling grid doesn't hide where the copied light is. Also if I move the ceiling grid, all the ceiling objects move with the ceiling except those that are copied. They all have the "moves with nearby elements" checked.

If I start a new project, add a ceiling and place the 2'x4' lights then copy them, those work fine. It must be something inside my project.

I've tried deleteing the ceiling and placeing a new one but I still have the same problem with the ceiling objects. Any suggestions? This takes too much time not being able to copy objects.

[aggockel50321]

I had an experience similar to yours. What I found is that I had created a plain ceiling with the (one click) ceiling tool.

Then later on, went to the RCP, didn't see a ceiling, & placed a 2x2 act ceiling with the ceiling tool. When I placed the lights, they chose the generic ceiling for a host, & when I adjusted the grid, they stayed where they were.

I was really frustrating, until I realized what I'd done. :oops:

The one click ceiling tool is great, except when you stutter-step with the mouse click.

[Griff]

Thanks Andrew for the reply. Your experiance sounds like it could be similar to what's happening in my project. How do I find a ceiling that the light fixture is associated to?

I deleted the ceiling in one room that had both new and copied from new light fixtures. When I deleted the ceiling, the new light fixtures disappeared with the ceiling but the copied lights remained.

I guess I could have placed a ceiling over my whole model that the light fixture is attaching to, but how do I find that ceiling? I've tried tabing around but I only come up with the 2'x2' ceiling. Any suggestions?

[Steve_Stafford]

Use a crossing selection window (as opposed to the window selection option) that crosses over the entire room, filter for ceiling objects and see what you have left...

[Griff]

Wow, now this is wierd :screwy:

I did a crossing over my whole project and filtered out the ceilings and deleted ALL of them but the copied light fixtures remained. Then I looked at a demolition drawing and the outline of the light fixture shows up in the existing ceiling. If I delete that existing ceiling (which in the project get demoed) and go to my new phase ceiling the copied light fixture is gone.

So, my new light fixture that I copied in the new phase and lists as being Phase:new, is being associated to an existing phase ceiling.

Any suggestions on how to fix that????

[aggockel50321]

If the existing ceiling to be demo'd is not demo'd, demo it & the light fixtures will be demo'd with it.

Funny, if you go to a later phase view of the ceiling, & have the demo'd ceiling showing ("show all" filter), it'll still accept light fixtures, and then if you change the phase filter to "show complete" the ceiling goes (as expected) but the new fixture set into the demo'd ceiling remains.

I think what you'll have to do is delete or demo any fixtures that got mistakenly set in the earlier phase ceiling.

Then, change your phase filter to not show the demo'd ceiling, place your new ceiling, & then insert your new fixtures.

[aggockel50321]

Funny, if you go to a later phase view of the ceiling, & have the demo'd ceiling showing ("show all" filter), it'll still accept light fixtures,

It's also the same case with walls with hosted items. (You can place windows & doors in a demo'd wall)

Not quite sure what the intent or reasoning is here...

[Griff]

I'm confused, this is how it is intended to act?

I have attached a couple of images. Notice that the exist has the cutouts in the exist (demoed) ceiling but no fixture.

My demoed ceiling is showing "show demo + exist" and my new is showing "show previous + new"

This is really confussing

[aggockel50321]

Your confusion might be in the phase filter settings. The default phase setting names can be confusing.

Check closely what each phase filter does, & see if it matches your intent.

If you want to place light fixtures in a ceiling created in the current phase, be sure that any ceilings demolished in this or earlier phases are not displayed, as the placed light fixtures may choose one of them as their host.

[Griff]

I appreciate your patients, but from what I can tell, my phase settings show what I want.

The existing ceiling is created and demoed in the existing phase. I don't show new items in the "show demo + exist" and I don't show demolished or temporary items in the "show previous + new" phase.

[Allen Lacy]

I appreciate your patients, but from what I can tell, my phase settings show what I want.

The existing ceiling is created and demoed in the existing phase. I don't show new items in the "show demo + exist" and I don't show demolished or temporary items in the "show previous + new" phase.

If you create and demolish something in the same phase, it becomes a temporary phase object. Try demoing your existing ceiling in the new construction phase.

[Griff]

I was thinking that would probably be the fix, but it is still reacting the same.

I tried demolishing the exist ceiling in a new phase in this project and in a new project but still with the same results.

I started a new project (residential template) and found out the only time a copied lite masked out the ceiling grid and associated with the new ceiling is when there wasn't an existing ceiling that was demoed.

Demolishing the ceiling in the new construction phase didn't work for you did it?

[Steve_Stafford]

I get similar results if I copy an existing fixture that has been demolished. The short answer is don't copy existing/demolished fixtures, place new ones and you won't have a problem. However you should contact support so they are aware of the issue.

[Griff]

Thanks for all the help.

The only thing I need to clearify is that I am not copying existing/demolished fixtures. These are new fixtures in a new ceiling. I was just trying to copy the new one I installed because that way I don't have to rotate it and it is already placed on a corner point of the grid.

I'll send this thread to support and see if they need more information.

[Steve_Stafford]

Copying a new fixture behaves equally bad for me as well...(didn't try that before, got the impression you copied exg/demo ones).

[aggockel50321]

The only thing I need to clearify is that I am not copying existing/demolished fixtures. These are new fixtures in a new ceiling. I was just trying to copy the new one I installed because that way I don't have to rotate it and it is already placed on a corner point of the grid.


I think the only way to avoid this problem is to turn that demolished ceiling off before placing or copying fixtures in the later phase, and that can be accomplished with phase filters.

Not sure if this was the developers' intent (the ability to place objects in demolished hosts) or an oversight. There might be a reason for it. I just can't think of one now...

[Steve_Stafford]

The phase filters are being used to turn off the existing ceiling...the copied fixture seems to only cut the existing ceiling even thought it is isn't "present". I submitted a sample project to Revit Support...

[aggockel50321]

I see what you mean now.

I tried, and got the same behavior with a wall & door.

[Griff]

Just a follow up on this thread. It's not a fix, but it's a workaround.
I talked with David Haynes (Imaginit) and he informed me if I do the following, I can copy lights and they will attach to the correct ceiling.
Unless I'm missing something, I still don't see how you can copy this way and be precise (from intersection to intersection). But at least this tells the correct way to copy object. Appearently, using the "edit>copy" option doesn't produce the same results.

1. Make sure the "Press and Drag" option is checked
2. Pick the light object (highlight) to copy.
3. Place the cursor over the light until the cursor changes to a 4 arrow move symbol.
4. Hold the Ctrl key (copy) down and drag/drop the light where you want it copied to.

[Steve_Stafford]

Copy/Paste works as well. If you layout a room and it is similar to others, place all your fixtures, copy then paste into the other room(s). They will attach to the ceiling correctly.

[Griff]

You're correct, unless you have an existing ceiling in that room that was previously demolished and you are placing light fixtures in the new ceiling grid. At least it doesn't work for me.

[Steve_Stafford]

It does work for me in that instance