res floor framing

[patagoniadave]

Um, hi everyone. I just read ALL the old posts I could find about Revit doing residential framing plans, and the debate as to why it should or shouldn't be able to and it was all very interesting, but.... I'm still a little confused as to what the easy way to do it is.

What would be nice for me is if the floor framing (2X12' @ 16" o.c.) showed up in sections so I don't have to scetch them in by hand, and if I could generate some basic framing plans that just show the direction that the joists went in. I guess it would also be cool if my walls all knew that they had plates that showed up on the top and bottom.

So back to the floors, should I modify an out of the box floor and model some framing members in (if someone else has done it wants to share, I'd be grateful) and if so how would I tell the floor what way the joists went. Or, should I do the framing seperate from the floor, and wrap the floor around it? Or should I just do as the others and do all the framing 2d.

I'd really like to have the framing automatic , just makes sense for the type of drawings I am doing.

Thanks all, I am a little braindead because I just spent a month trying to get our two legacy acad projects out the door, and now I have forgotten half of what I knew in Revit (which wasn't much) :-(

[Justin Marchiel]

you might be able to use beam systems to make your framing plans. It is not "automatic" as you have to sketch the outline, but at least it will fill in all the joist in between. the floor would then just be the sheathing.

This will still take you 2 steps, but it would be faster than drawing individual beams.


Justin

[patagoniadave]

you might be able to use beam systems to make your framing plans. It is not "automatic" as you have to sketch the outline, but at least it will fill in all the joist in between. the floor would then just be the sheathing.

This will still take you 2 steps, but it would be faster than drawing individual beams.


Justin

Ok, I'll have to read my manual on beam systems, it isn't something I've played with yet, but it sounds like what I want to do. Thanks for the tip

[Scott D Davis]

model your floors as the "subfloor" material. If it's plywood or OSB, then model the "floor" as that. Make it 3/4" or 5/8" of an inch thick. Model the joists with beam systems as already recommended.

[patagoniadave]

model your floors as the "subfloor" material. If it's plywood or OSB, then model the "floor" as that. Make it 3/4" or 5/8" of an inch thick. Model the joists with beam systems as already recommended.

That makes sense, what about the strapping and gyp on the bottom of the joists, should I use another floor, or is there a better trick? Thanks Scott.

[Scott D Davis]

Gyp on the bottom of the joists can be modeled as a ceiling. Then it can host lights and other ceiling based objects. Strapping? Not sure exactly what this means?

[patagoniadave]

Gyp on the bottom of the joists can be modeled as a ceiling. Then it can host lights and other ceiling based objects. Strapping? Not sure exactly what this means?

sorry probably using slang. The "one by" that most people screw to the bottom of floor joists, perpendicular to the joists, which they in turn screw the gyp to. I have no idea what the real term for it is. That I don't mind drawing in by hand, but I want to get the 3/4" space between the gyp and studs to show up. Thanks again

[robert.manna]

I call it strapping too! But maybe that's cause I'm originally from MA. :)

You can include it as part of your ceiling assembly.


-R

[patagoniadave]

I call it strapping too! But maybe that's cause I'm originally from MA. :)

You can include it as part of your ceiling assembly.


-R

Very cool, you guys are the best.

Wow , I am originally from AZ, I wonder if I went home, would I sound like I talk with a MA accent?

[Scott D Davis]

sorry probably using slang. The "one by" that most people screw to the bottom of floor joists, perpendicular to the joists, which they in turn screw the gyp to. I have no idea what the real term for it is. That I don't mind drawing in by hand, but I want to get the 3/4" space between the gyp and studs to show up. Thanks again
hmmmm, thats interesting. Here, in So Cal, the Gyp is just screwed directly to the joists. What advantage does the "strapping" afford?

[robert.manna]

hmmmm, thats interesting. Here, in So Cal, the Gyp is just screwed directly to the joists. What advantage does the "strapping" afford?
Quite honestly in this case I don't know, but I'm just a young kid, so maybe somebody with a few more years of experience can chime in. There are a couple of reasons I can think of though...

1) if your joists were greater then 16" O.C.

2) back in the day they didn't have 4x8 (or larger) sheets of GWB, so you might want something at a tighter spacing to attached to.

3) back in the day when lumber was an even rougher cut then what we see today strapping with some shimming could help even out the ceiling.... (I'm reaching on this one I think....)

All just guesses on my part... Probably all wrong too. :)

-R

[Scott D Davis]

I'm guessing maybe it comes from the "plaster" era? Maybe the strapping was to hold the lath? Is the strapping placed closer that 16" OC?

[patagoniadave]

hmmmm, thats interesting. Here, in So Cal, the Gyp is just screwed directly to the joists. What advantage does the "strapping" afford?

I just asked the architect and structural engineer, they said it is to adjust for any differences in the dimensional lumber, so you can have a flat smooth veneer plaster. Maybe the wood moves more here in the humidity, maybe it is just a habit?

[patagoniadave]

Hey guys, am I going to be able to use this same approach for roofs? Seems a little trickier. Thanks.

[Justin Marchiel]

Sure why not?

Justin

[patagoniadave]

Is the strapping placed closer that 16" OC?

12"on center

[Justin Marchiel]

12"on center


before no sag board i remember that 1/2" would sag if used for a ceiling. you would have to strap it, or use 5/8" board.

Justin

[patagoniadave]

Sure why not?

Justin

:-) because I have spent the past four hours trying to get a pretty simple (in my mind) roof to work, and am nervous about how hard it will be to transition it to a framed roof with a skin on it, but I haven't tried yet, and maybe it will be simple

[ford347]

Using structural members and 'beam systems' in flat conditions i.e. floors etd., work really well. It's quick, has a great plan view representation in my opinion, and show's up everywhere else. For roofs, it's a little different story. You can still use beams and beam systems, but out of the box you won't get any structural member that you can put a head cut or have clean joins on. But floor, I would use the structural tools. Good luck!

Josh

[patagoniadave]

Using structural members and 'beam systems' in flat conditions i.e. floors etd., work really well. It's quick, has a great plan view representation in my opinion, and show's up everywhere else. For roofs, it's a little different story. You can still use beams and beam systems, but out of the box you won't get any structural member that you can put a head cut or have clean joins on. But floor, I would use the structural tools. Good luck!

Josh

thats what I was afraid of, thanks though.

[Scott D Davis]

Using structural members and 'beam systems' in flat conditions i.e. floors etd., work really well. It's quick, has a great plan view representation in my opinion, and show's up everywhere else. For roofs, it's a little different story. You can still use beams and beam systems, but out of the box you won't get any structural member that you can put a head cut or have clean joins on. But floor, I would use the structural tools. Good luck!

Josh
Question is, do you need a head cut on every single member, when you are only gonna see one at a time in section? I'd use 2D linework and filled regions to make these appear correct in your section views/details, rahter than trying to model it. The time saved using the beam tools will far outweigh the time it takes to make a custom beam.