SOM to use Revit for new WTC design!

[Scott D Davis]

Here's some clips from the press release:


Autodesk, Inc., the world’s leading design software and digital content company, announced today that it is working closely with Skidmore, Owings, & Merrill (SOM), the design architect of the first tower to rise on the World Trade Center site, to define optimal technology and collaboration protocols for this highly symbolic and technically complex project.

As a longstanding technology partner to SOM, Autodesk is advising the team on how to best implement Autodesk® Buzzsaw® Professional and a range of design software, from AutoCAD® to Autodesk® Revit®, to help it realize the highest quality design for America’s new civic icon.

The team is also using the Autodesk Revit building information modeling platform on the whole building, including complex sub-grade levels. Autodesk® Architectural Desktop is being employed for energy analysis with a third-party application, and Discreet® 3ds max® software is being used for design visualization and creation of 3D renderings and animations.

Read more HERE (http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/item?siteID=123112&id=4418374&linkID=1977925)

[aaronrumple]

Wow. Sounds like SOM should hire the entire Zoog membership....

[MikeJarosz]

YUP....

We couldn't disclose the news until all the contracts were signed, but the word is out. We've been modelling WTC in Revit for a couple of months now. We have the model from sub-basement to 1000 feet. Full #D cores, toilets structure, exterior wall -- it's all in there. AutoDesk will be using this project to promote Revit, so stay tuned.

[Scott D Davis]

Sweet! That is sooo cool! We need to see some images in the gallery if you are able to post some!!!!

[Wes Macaulay]

That is unbelievably cool news guys. Someone's gotta give Eureka Tower a run for their money, hmm?

[mlgatzke]

After this, no one's going to bad-mouth Revit anymore. Hopefully, this one project will anchor Revit in the minds of all architectural firms as serious software to be evaluated for serious firms. Nobody's taking Revit seriously around here. Well, not nobody, but I've only taught one class with 7 students in it in the past year. Nobody else is even asking me about it or mentioning it. Sad really.

[Arnel Aguel]

Very very cool. Can't wait to see the whole project done.

This just proved that people are already aware of the capability of the most powerful architectural software on earth. Not to mention the aim of Autodesk to make it a complete building information modeller.

Oh man just pretty cool. The sleeping giant has already woke up.

[Vincent Valentijn]

YUP....

We couldn't disclose the news until all the contracts were signed, but the word is out. We've been modelling WTC in Revit for a couple of months now. We have the model from sub-basement to 1000 feet. Full #D cores, toilets structure, exterior wall -- it's all in there. AutoDesk will be using this project to promote Revit, so stay tuned.

Mike.. I believe I'm in the dark. I'm just a Euro architect who's not being very attentive I guess but; I thought the new WTC was designed by Libeskind? I don't get it, on the SOM site there's not a mention of him..
I must have missed something huge, I feel like I have a cow in my eye but I can't see it? :(
If anyone could, could you fill me in on the facts?

[PeterJ]

There has been a lot of background maneouvering, Vincent, which has been reported here (UK, not AUGI) and I think that Liebeskind is sidelined or out of the frame altogether.

[fernando]

revit in the Freedom Tower

http://www.architectureweek.com/cgi-bin/wllk?http://www10.aeccafe.com/nbc/articles/view_article.php?section=CorpNews&articleid=129679

Mod note: Merged this post into this thread...

[David Sammons]

The press release states:

"AutoCAD software serves as the project’s primary 2D and 3D design and documentation tool. Because AutoCAD is a highly customizable application, SOM has been able to create tools in AutoCAD to facilitate modeling the complex building geometry as well as design variations, and to coordinate different aspects of the Freedom Tower design. The team is also using the Autodesk Revit building information modeling platform on the whole building, including complex sub-grade levels."

I wonder why there is a need to use both AutoCAD AND Revit with AutoCAD being the PRIMARY 2D and 3D design and documentation tool.

Dave S.

[aggockel50321]

wonder why there is a need to use both AutoCAD AND Revit with AutoCAD being the PRIMARY 2D and 3D desing and documentation tool.

Sounds like the ADT marketing folks are making sure they get mentioned in the release.

Seems to follow the similar outcry that ensued when the president of Autodesk recommended that ADT customers consider migrating to Revit a few years back.

[Martin P]

I wonder why there is a need to use both AutoCAD AND Revit with AutoCAD being the PRIMARY 2D and 3D desing and documentation tool.

Dave S.

Does it matter? I use both Revit and Autocad on most of my projects because they are 2 very good tools. Each has some unique abilities in areas that the other does not - they compliment each other very well on any project...

[MikeJarosz]

Daniel Libeskind won the competition for the site plan. His site plan is basically what is being implemented. However, he was not retained by anyone to design a building, despite the fact that he had strong opinions on that issue and made them known to everyone. Nevertheless, we have respected his views.

Regarding the various AutoDesk products mentioned in the press release, the design of the WTC has been in the works for some time. Just about every piece of software imaginable has been used to create the images you've seen. We started using Revit about two months ago because the below grade was so intricate we wanted a 3D modeller that would help us better envision the complexities of that part of the project. It went so smoothly, we expanded it into the tower.

So far, we are not using Revit for it's rendering capabilities. The design has progressed so far with other products that we will most likely continue with them. We are however building a full 3D model for construction documents. AutoDesk has been with us all the way on this.

We are also working with our consulting engineers and AutoDesk to add engineering (mechanical and structural) to the Revit BIM package. AutoDesk will probably make an announcement when they're ready.

[JamesVan]

I wonder why there is a need to use both AutoCAD AND Revit with AutoCAD being the PRIMARY 2D and 3D design and documentation tool.


As you can imagine, this project team is larger than most offices so there is a fair amount of legacy work that must continue in AutoCAD, VIZ, etc. Our primary use of 3D AutoCAD is based on parametrically controlled LISP routines that generate the building's complex shell and structural geometry (see the press releases here: http://www.som.com/press_release)

We are working our way from the core out to the exterior shell in Revit. The intricate pleated shell design is a challenge to create in a custom family, but not impossible (see attached).

On a side note, Michael is the team's new "model manager" and has decades of experience with multiple CAD systems including SOM's own AES platform. He is repeatedly asked how the team is faring with the new platform and his answer is almost always..."we're having FUN!"

More to come...

[christopher.zoog51272]

awesome James and Mike, I can't wait to see more!

[Les Therrien]

Do you think they'll post the file for us to download and take a look???

[MikeJarosz]

Do you think they'll post the file for us to download and take a look???

Uh......, the whole world would like to see the insides of this one. For obvious reasons, we can't do that.

[BillyGrey]

Congratulations SOM,
Congratulations Autodesk,
Congratulations to all of us

This is really good news,

And this is some of the best:


"We are also working with our consulting engineers and AutoDesk to add engineering (mechanical and structural) to the Revit BIM package. "

B

[hand471037]

One thing to consiter is that a project of this size and scope involves a lot of different consultants. I'm currently talking with a local firm here that wants to use Revit on a *very* large project, and one of the biggest snags is that there are several sub-architects and consultants that won't be on Revit, due to the fact that they aren't big enough to absorb the cost of switching quickly for this single project. So there are many concerns on all sides about data transfer, and I'm helping to smooth and demostrate that these snags won't be deal-breakers.

So I think that's why the press release talks about AutoCAD/ADT too, for even tho SOM might be doing all their work in Revit or Revit & AutoCAD, there will be subs under their contract that might use different tools.

[BillyGrey]

So true Jeffrey, and I am so glad that Revit handles exporting dwg.'s to AIA standards so much better than I could ever hope to.

What a great tool.

[David Sammons]

Does it matter? I use both Revit and Autocad on most of my projects because they are 2 very good tools. Each has some unique abilities in areas that the other does not - they compliment each other very well on any project...

It does not surprise me that a project of this size with a vast number of team members uses a variety of Autodesk applications. However, I am curious about whether AutoCAD or Revit is the PRIMARY design and documentation tool. If it is Revit, then this press release is even more favorable for those of us who rely more on Revit than AutoCAD.

[MikeJarosz]

We are doing the schematic design in Revit, with the intent that we will continue into CD's. Acad is still being used by some team members at SOM who haven't learned Revit. And we have to export Revit to Acad frequently because most of the world uses Acad. However, the focus here is definitely on Revit.

As James said above, the design team started out using applications other than Revit a long time ago, and are too advanced to switch, but we do have some of them trained and ready to go.

[funkman]

Hi Mike,

al lof this sounds fantastic. If you could, I am sure that many of us here, including me, would be very much interested in the specs on your machines to handle such a project and the setups.

[bh]

This is awesome news and my congratulations go out to you James, Mike and your whole team at SOM.

I have spent the better part of the last year along with my support team led by zoog and now augi contributor Wes Macaulay trying to convince the architectural community of the merits of Revit. Unfortunately, the only ones reading this are already convinced. Nevertheless, if Revit can be used on this project, it will validate its use on a variety of projects everywhere. It will be difficult for a condo designer here, or someone working on a winter Olympics site in nearby Whistler to claim that they cannot meet their deadlines while learning Revit!

[cdobiecki]

Sounds like the ADT marketing folks are making sure they get mentioned in the release.

Seems to follow the similar outcry that ensued when the president of Autodesk recommended that ADT customers consider migrating to Revit a few years back.

I also heard an ADT instructor saying: "Ask if Revit can support a building taller than 22 floors..." I will like to see the whole WTC tower in Revit.

[Wes Macaulay]

Tall buildings are a snap in Revit. WTC's skewed parallelogram is more of a challenge, but nothing the software can't handle.

Tell your instructor that Revit, in our testing, outperforms ADT in almost any building type. Also tell him, if he's looking for dirt on Revit, that migrating to Revit might not be worthwhile if

you use 2D AutoCAD (or another CAD platform) to design a lot of 2/3 storey multi-family housing where the plans are re-used between projects. Firms like this are such a well-oiled machine that migrating them to Revit would be painful. They also are not needing Revit's scheduling abilities nearly as much as architects designing other building types
you don't have enough work to afford to switch. Buying Revit makes a lot of sense if you're turning away work, or are really swamped
When I say Revit outperforms ADT, this is what I mean:

faster rotation of models in 3D
sections and elevations generated in Revit are done so in a fraction (less than 25%) of the time required to do so in ADT
I recommend ADT only to firms already using the software, for whom learning the Project Navigator (to get the building model created) and Sheet Sets is an incremental task compared to switching platforms altogether. We have but one firm that is using ADT 2005 with Project Navigator, and they're having major problems, most of it likely caused by the fact that they're using Novell networking.

[FK]

When I say ADT outperforms Revit, this is what I mean:
Do you mean the other way around?