Navigating up & down in plan view

[iandidesign]

Howdy,
sorry if this noob question has been asked before, but I'm looking for the best way to move vertically through my floor plan views. In ArchiCAD a keyboard shortcut will move you up or down a story (level) leaving the zoom, layers, and other settings unchanged. The navigator (project browser) can be used to jump multiple stories with the same effect. It's a great way to see and work on parts of the model that are directly above or below each other. Is there a similar technique is Revit? Thanks.

[dhurtubise]

There's no such feature in Revit. You either use the Project Browser or the symbol to go from view to view.

[iamreavis]

You can use CTRL+Tab to switch between open windows.

[gbrowne]

Or indeed use the underlay command to superimpose another level, for tracing walls, etc..

[iandidesign]

Thanks guys. I have discovered those techniques.

I still think Revit would benefit from some kind of "vertical scrolling" where the zoom, crop, visibility graphics, etc. all remain the same while the user is able to navigate up or down the levels.

Underlays could also use some help. An on/off keyboard shortcut for starters. And the ability to define underlays dynamically, like previous level, is another.

[dhurtubise]

The symbol means that you can double-click on an elevation symbol to open that view

[cdatechguy]

Thanks guys. I have discovered those techniques.

I still think Revit would benefit from some kind of "vertical scrolling" where the zoom, crop, visibility graphics, etc. all remain the same while the user is able to navigate up or down the levels.

Underlays could also use some help. An on/off keyboard shortcut for starters. And the ability to define underlays dynamically, like previous level, is another.
Worthy of wish list perhaps?

Actually a lot of my wishes are features that ArchiCAD has.... One I just thought of is the ability to join roofs by clicking on the edge then clicking the target. Jealous though, I am still using 8.1, and your using 11. :|

[iandidesign]

In my fantasy I build a new BIM app with features cherry picked from ArchiCAD, Revit, Miscrostation, VectorWorks, SketchUp....

Shows what an aging CAD geek I've become.

[Scott D Davis]

Shows what an aging CAD geek I've become.

As you are a long time Archicad user and a frequent poster on their forums, what are your impressions of Revit being a newbie? I like your idea of 'the best of the best' which seems to be happening slowly in some ways as all these products compete and evolve.

(This will take this thread off topic so a moderator may want to split it out to a new thread if Geoff replies.)

[Paul Andersen]

While probably not as convenient as the command you describe there is a technique that works for plans and other like views with regards to the zoomed area. I typically use the workflow outlined below with the views maximized as changing zoomed in areas requires the use of the Close Hidden Windows command.

Workflow:

Open any floor plan and maximize the view.

Make sure no other plan views that you want zoomed the same way are open (you can use the Close Hidden Windows command to make short order of this).

Zoom into the area you wish to investigate.

Now open any other floor plan of the same scale through the browser and note that the zoom and location are identical to that of the previous plan. As already mentioned above CTRL+Tab can then be used to cycle through all of the open plan views.

To change the zoomed area simply pan or zoom to the new location in any of the open plans. Close Hidden Windows and reopen the other plans of interest again.

I suppose the visibility graphics could be easily handled by applying a view template to the plan views prior to the use of this technique.

I would also recommend using named scope boxes to define crop regions consistently across multiple plan views.

[iandidesign]

As you are a long time Archicad user...what are your impressions of Revit being a newbie?

Hi Scott,
I was wondering when you'd notice me here.

It's difficult to answer your question in any meaningful way. These applications are so vast, and we become so accustomed to their idiosyncrasies, that it is hard to gain perspective when evaluating something new. You miss what you don't have. Appreciating the differences is another matter. Sometimes it's "WTF are they thinking", other times it's "finally, someone get's it", other things take time. When I started with ArchiCAD I found the working method very odd. Coming from VectorWorks it felt backwards, like reading right to left. Now I'm fluent and consider ArchiCAD the superior program, although I can still list everything that VectorWorks does better.

Back to your question. Revit seems very logical and the developers exhibit a good knowledge of construction, and the construction document process. It's quite streamlined and not hard to learn. It's very deep without being initially, or continually, overwhelming.

I'm not yet sold on the concept of temporary dimensions for initial object placement. I'm always wanting to offset from someplace they don't "see". OTOH I like that dimensions can become user defined parameters. Aligning to remote points could also be better, and is better in ArchiCAD and VectorWorks, both of which have very good temporary guide lines.

One of Revit's well known features is relationships. Since ArchiCAD has nothing like this I am looking very hard at them. I love the ability to embed design intent so support the concept. But I keep reading (on these forums) of how relationships are inferred by the software and created automatically, which I think is a huge mistake. IMO they should only be established deliberately by the user.

The other well known feature is no layers. So far I really like this.

Tagging, schedules, keynotes, legends all appear superior to ArchiCAD.

ArchiCAD appears to hold an edge in the 3D working environment, navigation, drafting, layouting, and workspace customization. And ArchiCAD's Info Box, which provides real-time info and editing of selected objects rules over Revit's Options Bar/Element Settings, which doesn't even tell you how many objects are selected and cannot act on the common parameters of different objects.

My two biggest complaints with Revit (other that the Info Box) are 1) performance, which is terrible on my admittedly ****** PC (P4 1.8GHz) and 2) window handling. I'm spoiled by using ArchiCAD on a Mac which has Apple's great Exposé feature for moving between open windows and works swell with multiple monitors.

You can tell that I like ArchiCAD quite a bit. The reason that I'm giving Revit a hard look is that it appears very well engineered under the hood. The vast majority of shortcomings are related to the interface, a situation that is much easier to remedy than if it were the other way around. I do wish they would develop a native Mac version. That effort would be great for the Revit interface and be welcomed by architects everywhere.

[ws]

I'm not yet sold on the concept of temporary dimensions for initial object placement. I'm always wanting to offset from someplace they don't "see"

It's a small thing, and you may know this already, but as a long-time Allplan user coming to Revit this also drove me nuts... until I read in a post here that you can just drag the offered dimension points to wherever you want them (or click them if on such as a wall to hop to the other side). Not perfect but less annoying.

[iandidesign]

Thanks William.

Yes I figured that out. My frustration has been that after perfecting ArchiCAD's not well documented but very precise methods for placing objects or initiating a drawing operation at exactly the spot I want, Revit tries to anticipate some offsets or alignments, but if they are not the ones I want there is no on-the-fly way to make that happen. But...

Since Revit has relationships it would appear (and the tutorials suggest) that the most controlled way to work is often to create an object at an arbitrary size and then align or dimension it to other objects / grids / levels depending on design intent. Am I correct?

I am also not sold on Sketch Mode. Creating a floor for example. Why not just draw / edit a polygon? I'm guessing it's so the user can constrain the individual segments, as opposed to the entire object.But when drafting a filled region it just seems silly.

[Calvn_Swing]

While I find that Revit's guestimation can be frustrating when it is automatically defining relationships, I have learned workflows that allow me to prevent these automatic associations when necessary. Most of the time, Revit picks pretty well once you understand how it is picking things. In the cases you don't like what it is guessing, there are easy ways to either place it with limited associations or to clean the slate and start over (move + disjoin).

In terms of best practices for modeling: "create an object at an arbitrary size and then align or dimension it to other objects / grids / levels depending on design intent" is about as eloquent as I've seen it said.

Back to the original question...

If you don't mind working in 3D, I find that opening a 3D view and orienting it to a level 1 plan view is a good starter (turns on the section box and gets you orthogonal in one step). You can then open a building elevation view and make is about the same size (or thinner) as the browser window. Now, make your 3D plan take up the rest of the screen. When you want to zoom up to the next level, select the section box in the plan, hop into the elevation view, and then simply use the move command (or drag) to move it up a level! You can also just move the top of the box if you prefer. Hop back into your plan and there you are!

Given, it takes a little set up, but since I work in 3D primarily I find this much more useful than cycling through plan views. And, I can always hold down shift and instantly see the model in 3D. Then "orient to view" and I'm back in "plan" action...

[iandidesign]

CAD/BIM always stimulates great examples of lateral, or in this case vertical, thinking.

Laziness is the mother of invention.

[rob.197147]

A slight variation to the last suggestion, where not everything need be fully formed 3D:

In any section viewport, create a Level anywhere vertically. Call it 'Throwaway' or 'Traveling' or 'Utility' ( I like the last because it tends to be at the bottom of the Browser's plan list ).

When the need arises to scan vertically then on any elevation, or section nearby i can drag it up and down. I duplicate it for type, so it has a green colour, looks instantly different as "The One", and if it gets printed, it won't duplicate under the photocopiers green light.

I also find it handy to limit its upper and lower view extents to something very tight ( Zero within 50mm ) so i can isolate just the things i'm cutting through if that's the view i want as an underlay, then in real time i can control what shows up. Great for isolating elements in readiness for linework tool one without resorting to the wireframe view

And this trick i nutted out within 2 weeks of laying eyes on Revit, before any more 'formal' training.