Showing Floor Finishes

[lhanyok]

I have a user that wants to differentiate between different colors of VCT on her finish plan. I suggested drawing a finish floor using the method of a separate floor. That works fine to get the overall hatch pattern of the 12 x 12 tiles, and we'll be able to tag the different colors of VCT.

However, she wants to give different hatches on top of the tile hatch to illustrate the different colors, as shown in the attached image. My first thought would be to draw filled regions over top of the floors in the finish plan - but that seemed a bit un-Revitish since there's no automatic coordination between the filled region hatch and the actual floor. Any ideas?

[patricks]

I only know of 2 other options, both of which will be just as tedious:

1. Create separate floor elements for each color of VCT. The drawback here is that you won't have the entire grid on the floor to layout the different color areas.

2. Split the surface of your VCT floor element and use your paint bucket to paint each area. Equally as tedious, and it might break if you ever have to modify the floor element, whereas filled regions can just be re-aligned to the grid of the floor changes.

We have been doing floor finishes as 1/8" thick ceilings set at 0" above the floor level. That way it you can place a floor finish in a room with a single click. We still show different VCT colors with transparent filled regions in the finish plan view.

[Justin Marchiel]

patricks the ceiling method is interresing. can you assign a sweep to the ceiling (ie for a base?). i guess to make things quick i could use the quick select ceiling, copy the sketch lines, and paste into a floor.

Justin

[lhanyok]

1. Create separate floor elements for each color of VCT. The drawback here is that you won't have the entire grid on the floor to layout the different color areas.

Sorry, I wasn't very clear in my original post - that is what we're doing. This way we can tag the different floor finish colors (VCT-1, VCT-2) etc. in our finish plan.


We still show different VCT colors with transparent filled regions in the finish plan view.

However, she wants to show an additional hatch on top of the tile on finish plans to differentiate between different colors in what will be printed out in black and white, in addition to tagging the different areas - which is why I think we'll also use filled regions.

I just don't want to make this too complicated - I sometimes fall into the trap of trying so hard to make something more Revit-like than is currently possible.

[mthurnauer]

It sounds like you are making it too complicated. Is this going to be a continuing pattern? If so, it seems you would be better off showing the origin point of the pattern on the finish plan and refering to a detail drawing that would establish the pattern. This would allow you to make changes to the design without always having to revise the flooring.

[patricks]

However, she wants to show an additional hatch on top of the tile on finish plans to differentiate between different colors in what will be printed out in black and white, in addition to tagging the different areas - which is why I think we'll also use filled regions.

I just don't want to make this too complicated - I sometimes fall into the trap of trying so hard to make something more Revit-like than is currently possible.

You could create custom model patterns that have both the 12" square grid and the hatch pattern lines. You have to be fairly familiar w/ how patterns are created in Revit, though, using Notepad and saving it as a .PAT file.

[dhurtubise]

I agree with Patrick, and you can then override the graphics to have differnet color if needed

[twiceroadsfool]

I agree with Patrick, and you can then override the graphics to have differnet color if needed

I would make them seperate floors, with different surface patterns by type.

I suck at code, even the pathetic code necessary to make patterns. So i use Hatchkit.

But it works amazingly well.

mthurnauer, what you say IS true about only needing the origin, but when the documents have every single ement on the floor pattern present, and they fit perfectly, they have no excuse ti sit there after the fact, with a change order for cracking tiles, AND a pattern that isnt what you drew, LOL.

Actually, during the punchlist, the subs that installed this entire tile arrangement complimented us on the drawings, because they went in without even questioning how well the pattern really worked, and we had even laid out specific dimensions of where to start the pattern, in each different field.

The ONLY area where the finished product differed at ALL from our model, was that there was an expansion joint that we hadnt put in, so they split one extra row of tiles...

Hatchkit, plus 1/8" thick floors on top of the concrete floors, plus a filter by comments field = no tiles anywhere but the finish plan, and a perfect product. :)

[patricks]

Hey that looks pretty cool. We usually just create a Floor Finishes workset that is off by default, and then just turn it on in the finish plan.

How did you make those reveals on the walls above the arches? Are they all in place or are some horizontal hosted and then the sloping ones in-place?

[weston]

It looks like there is a series of repeats in the tile pattern. Why dont you create a repeating detail with the pattern. This seems like the best way to create it so that you can edit it later. It would be difficult to edit the hatch if you wanted to change it.

[twiceroadsfool]

The hatch is easy to edit using Hatchkit. We dont want to use a repeating detail because then it is view specific, and not actually part of the model. This way, the client was able to see it in all of the views, and it updates as we moved the floor fields around to play with the spacing of the tiles.

Patrick- They are Wall Hosted Families. :)

There is one large one on the "end wall" and there is one that repeats every strucutral pay over the arched openings, and then one flat one for the last bay that has no arch. The hosted families worked beautifully. We didnt bother with the reveals, except in between the storefront systems on the end wall. We only did it there becayse the wall is split above and below the storefront...

EDIT: The Finished workset is a good idea as well. I suually dont condone using worksets for visibility control (i think it gets people in a "layers" mentality), but for finishes i could totally see it. We didnt, but this was also the only room in the entire mall that had finishes, so the filter seemed like the best approach at the time. Now, revisiting it, if i was doing en entire building, i would definetely make a finishes workset.

Then again, if i was REALLY doign interior design, id also make my finishes ont he walls, as seperate walls...

[lhanyok]

Thanks for all of your responses. I'm going to take a look at HatchKit and try to make a custom hatch pattern. I had enough trouble trying to make a custom CMU pattern with Notepad.

[mthurnauer]

Twiceroadsfool:
I understand where you are coming from, but I don't see how a broken tile would be your problem. It seems that we as a profession are going to need to figure out how to get paid for doing more work with BIM. Your example is perfect. The contractor was thankful that you had drawn out every single tile and it made his job easier, but you have essentially done some of his work for him and for no additional compensation. Why not show the pattern and layout point and expect the contractor to provide you with a shop drawing showing the entire layout? I think that one of the ways we could get paid for doing more work is to give contractors two options regarding shop drawings: 1) you could do it the old fashioned way. Look at docs, draw your own drawings or 2)Pay a fee to have access to the BIM model and take over a workset. I.E. the tile would become his and if you drew it like you did, he would be able to make a schedule of materials and be done.

As usual, we architects are giving away our services for nothing and are missing the boat. If we don't do something soon, it will be CMs that offer this service and will yet again get paid for work we usually do.