Recessed area in a wall... How is it done?

[thand]

How can you create a recessed area in a wall? e.g. a 6' x 6' brick area recessed into the main brick face by 1"? Look at the attached jpeg taken from a sketchup model of what I'm trying to do...


Thanks

[dhurtubise]

You could use a wall-based(or face-based) family with a void in it.

[thand]

You could use a wall-based(or face-based) family with a void in it.



So just create a wall based family with just a void extrusion in the family? I tried a void extrusion within the project near the wall, but was given the warning

"This Mass has no solid geometry for its Void Forms to cut. They must be deleted, or solid geometry added and cut."

So I'll try it in the family editor with a wall based family...

Thanks

[thand]

OK.. I tried a wall based family with only a void extrusion in the family, and I'm not sure what I'm doing wrong.... But the void family is not cutting the wall in the family editor or within the project.... I only get an outline of the void extrusion on the surface of the wall....

See the attached Jpeg....

[Carlos GT]

Try this:

Go to component in the modelling tab and click "create in place", call the family "generic model" and give it a name (recessed for examle). Then you will enter to a sketch mode, click in the "void form" and "void extrusion" option, now draw a void of the same size as you recessed. (this extrusion would be your recess, so part of it should be in the wall.
Then click in the "Cut geometry" tool and select the wall and then the void.
Finish your family.
That's it.

Good luck.

[thand]

Try this:

Go to component in the modelling tab and click "create in place", call the family "generic model" and give it a name (recessed for examle). Then you will enter to a sketch mode, click in the "void form" and "void extrusion" option, now draw a void of the same size as you recessed. (this extrusion would be your recess, so part of it should be in the wall.
Then click in the "Cut geometry" tool and select the wall and then the void.
Finish your family.
That's it.

Good luck.


I'll give it a try... Thanks for the quick response..

[dhurtubise]

If that condition repeats, avoid inplace. If you still use it, dont forget to use the cut geometry tool to cut the void.

[patricks]

In the past I have done it as in-place void cuts. Keep in mind to put reference planes around the boundaries of the recess whilst in the family editor. Otherwise you won't be able to dimension to the edges of the recess.

[thand]

OK, so I tried the inplace void family and it appeared to work, But....

After the cut geometry tool worked, my cut area and reveals lost there material / hatch pattern and turned grey. So I'm not sure if this method is the best way to do this unless we can regain the reveals and recessed material / hatch pattern.

See the 1st attached Jpeg...

So co-worker in the office here has found another method that works, but we want to make sure this is the best way of doing this recessed wall area. What he did was used the (Host Sweep - Wall Reveal) tool and created a reveal with the 6' height we needed. He then used the vertical toggle to place the reveal vertically which now gave us a 6' width. He then used the nods to pull the reveal to the desired height. It worked, but is this the best way??

See the 2nd Jpeg...


Thanks again...

[dhurtubise]

Thats the way to do if you wanna use the same material. The others wont get you the material

[thand]

Thats the way to do if you wanna use the same material. The others wont get you the material


Thanks... That's good to know...

[twiceroadsfool]

Thanks... That's good to know...


I would still use the Wall Hosted family, and simply use a void extrusion, and a solid extrusion in addition, with the Brick material.

It soulds like a ton of extra work, but you have the sketch done already for the void... Actually, i think i even copy/paste same place, and switch the properties to solid, but i cant remember when that works and doesnt. Then just adjust the thickness and youre good to go.

Then it will articulate well in section, as well. Is that thinner brick? Or brick set further back? You can demonstrate this with verry little effort in that family.

The sweep method works, but i find they arent consistantly reliable... And they move. Ive used wall hosted families for extensive reveal work (we do a lot of EIFS work, LOL) and i love how it works...

[boydb]

Originally Posted by carlos9t
Try this:

Go to component in the modelling tab and click "create in place", call the family "generic model" and give it a name (recessed for examle). Then you will enter to a sketch mode, click in the "void form" and "void extrusion" option, now draw a void of the same size as you recessed. (this extrusion would be your recess, so part of it should be in the wall.
Then click in the "Cut geometry" tool and select the wall and then the void.
Finish your family.
That's it.

Good luck.


Does this apply to Revit Structural as well. When I try it, I can only select the void but not the wall.

[dbaldacchino]

I would say that the most important question has not been asked....how do you plan to build it? Will the cavity in the wall get smaller? That might necessitate a new wall type so you can communicate to the builder how you want it built. Or are you changing the thickness of the veneer? Again, that would also necessitate a new wall type definition probably. There are many ways and techniques to achieve something. The most successful in Revit will be those that stay true to construction techniques. If just conveying the aesthetic, then any trick will do, but later you'll have to represent it properly if you want it built right.

EDIT: I assume you're moving the brick into the cavity (how did I miss that in the first line is beyond me lol!). I would personally create a new wall type and embed it in the original wall.

[dbaldacchino]

Here's what I'd do. Create the appropriate wall type and embed it by using the cut geometry tool. Then join geometry between the two.

[fixin.to]

Thats the way to do if you wanna use the same material. The others wont get you the material

It is possible to use the Paint tool to apply a pattern (brick or whatever) to the surfaces left by the void.

Of course, cutting a section thru the void area will not show the materials properly - which goes back to what you said about creating another wall type & following construction techniques - which is usually the best way to do it.

[Jun Austria]

OK, so I tried the inplace void family and it appeared to work, But....

After the cut geometry tool worked, my cut area and reveals lost there material / hatch pattern and turned grey. So I'm not sure if this method is the best way to do this unless we can regain the reveals and recessed material / hatch pattern.

See the 1st attached Jpeg...

So co-worker in the office here has found another method that works, but we want to make sure this is the best way of doing this recessed wall area. What he did was used the (Host Sweep - Wall Reveal) tool and created a reveal with the 6' height we needed. He then used the vertical toggle to place the reveal vertically which now gave us a 6' width. He then used the nods to pull the reveal to the desired height. It worked, but is this the best way??

See the 2nd Jpeg...


Thanks again...

How does it look in PLAN view?

[gary.mcleod]

Concurring with Dave: model like it's built!! New wall type is the way to go and readily available to you without complicated workarounds.

[twiceroadsfool]

I agree with Dave on modeling it like its built, but even with that i might still consider using a Wall Hosted family. The Family can have the void to remove the brick from the actual wall type, and can have the brick material remodeled in the recessed location.

The only reason i do it this way in similar situations, is that embedded walls/wall types are subject to shifting as wall joins and related objects are touched, and it also means that youd have to create the condition (wall in wall, correctly sized) over and over again, unless you model grouped it (which is still subject to some unwanted flexibility).

But yes, i agree: model it like its going to be built...