Configured window and door 3D DWG tool

[pjohnson.160245]

I work at a window and door manufacturing software company and we're looking to put together a tool that will allow Revit users to configure window and door products and generate a 3D dwg file. (Initially we were looking to programmatically generate Revit families but after some discussions with Revit representatives this is currently not possible. When that ability becomes available, that will most likely be our top development project.) Our vision is to provide a website or possibly even a browser window launched within Revit that would allow you to select a manufacturer, configure a unit (i.e. double hung window w/ a RO of 24 3/4" x 35 1/2", tempered glass and antique brass hardware) and then download a dwg of that configuration to import into Revit.

Some questions for Revit users are:
- Would a 3D dwg representation of a specific window or door be useful at all (rather than a parameterized Revit family)?
- What are the most important features of a window/door (i.e. RO size, grill bar appearances, glass type, hardware, etc) that you would like to see included in the dwg?
- Is there any interest in having a list of pre-configured units that you could choose from rather than selecting individual options and creating a configured unit?

I'm interested in all forms of feedback (if you think this is a terrible idea, let me know!) that people may have.

(Please note that this post is not intended as an advertisement or solicitation. Rather we'd like the feedback of the users who we hope would utilize this tool. I apologize in advance if the moderators find this post inappropriate.)

[jstamps]

- Would a 3D dwg representation of a specific window or door be useful at all (rather than a parameterized Revit family)?

I don't think that it would be useful at all, unfortunately, other than to graphically represent the window or door.
The reason why most of us use Revit is to organize and view information about the project, of which the graphic is only part. The abilities to use constraints, schedule information taken directly from the project's parts, perform building analysis, and create various types of views are all reasons why we need more information than a DWG import can provide. (There are probably many other reasons, but these are the ones I thought of off the top of my head.)

Many manufacturers have begun providing parametric Revit families (see http://labs.autodesk.com/technologies/contentsearch2/) which allow us to control sizes and requirements easily, while providing the information needed.

[Scott D Davis]

Initially we were looking to programmatically generate Revit families but after some discussions with Revit representatives this is currently not possible.

I'm not so sure that you were given the right information. Maybe a "tool" to create your doors and windows is not the answer. How large is your catalog of products? Your products could be created as Revit families with parametric controls to provide the options necessary as well as catalogs to control all the various sizes. This would be much more powerful than just simply 3D DWG's, and by creating Revit families, you would also very easily have a by-product of DWGs for those AutoCAD users out there.

Drop me an email or a private message here and I can provide you with more info.

(edit: perhaps I should have read more carefully...now I see that you are a software company, not a manufacturer. I thought you were a manufacturer, but contact me any way)

[pjohnson.160245]

I don't think that it would be useful at all, unfortunately, other than to graphically represent the window or door.
The reason why most of us use Revit is to organize and view information about the project, of which the graphic is only part. The abilities to use constraints, schedule information taken directly from the project's parts, perform building analysis, and create various types of views are all reasons why we need more information than a DWG import can provide. (There are probably many other reasons, but these are the ones I thought of off the top of my head.)

Many manufacturers have begun providing parametric Revit families (see http://labs.autodesk.com/technologies/contentsearch2/) which allow us to control sizes and requirements easily, while providing the information needed.

I have seen what some window and door manufacturers have done. Unfortunately, it is a manual effort to create the families. If a manufacturer offers a new line or makes substantial changes to an existing one, the manual effort to reflect this new information in Revit families is substantial. What we would like to do is tap into the Revit API and create the families programmatically based on the data contained in the quoting and manufacturing software (aka product knowledge). With this data we can determine available widths, heights, hardware options, etc, basically everything needed to define a window or door family within Revit. But after talking with some Revit folks, it doesn't appear that we can do that currently (Scott, check your PM and please tell me I'm wrong!). So we are exploring an interim solution of generating 3D dwg files. If a 3D dwg that is dimensioned correctly but does not have the parameters, constraints, etc of a family is not useful, that's the exact type of information I'm looking for.

[Jim Merritt]

I have seen what some window and door manufacturers have done. Unfortunately, it is a manual effort to create the families. If a manufacturer offers a new line or makes substantial changes to an existing one, the manual effort to reflect this new information in Revit families is substantial. What we would like to do is tap into the Revit API and create the families programmatically based on the data contained in the quoting and manufacturing software (aka product knowledge). With this data we can determine available widths, heights, hardware options, etc, basically everything needed to define a window or door family within Revit. But after talking with some Revit folks, it doesn't appear that we can do that currently (Scott, check your PM and please tell me I'm wrong!). So we are exploring an interim solution of generating 3D dwg files. If a 3D dwg that is dimensioned correctly but does not have the parameters, constraints, etc of a family is not useful, that's the exact type of information I'm looking for.

In transitioning from AutoCAD to Revit, it was initially hard to understand what I can do with out programming. A lot can be done with the family editor. I've created doors/windows for our company that can conform to any manufactures sizes with information such as you mention for tempered glass, egress, calculating the windows light/vent, etc. To give you my opinion, your company doesn't have anyone really good at creating Revit families. Revit families and type catalogs along with shared parameters. You can generate flexing graphical objects far faster than writing a program.

Regards,
--Jim

[Scott D Davis]

With this data we can determine available widths, heights, hardware options, etc, basically everything needed to define a window or door family within Revit.

I will contact you with more info, but fdor everyone's benefit I think this might help. Once the geometry of a family is created in Revit, all of the parameters (width, height, hardware options, etc.) can be driven by a simple Type Catalog which is just a text file. So as a manufacturer, one could create the geometry with parameters. If something changes (like a new size becomes available) one could simply supply a new Type Catalog. This type catalog will drive the parameters (whether geometric or not) and can update the family.

[bob.parker]

Isn't this what you are talking about?

http://www.parametrx.com/912/templates/index.asp

[DoTheBIM]

This seems to be the way the industry's going and our company heads want to push manufacure's to provide content as a requirement to do business with us as well. but I gotta say I'm a bit skeptical this wil be "way of the future". Downloading just 2 window families, the initial wow factor was quickly dismissed and reversed upon closer inspection of family construction and representation of what you click on in the website. Then placing it in my project revealed that revit "can't make type" due to one reason or another. I can agree that manufactures could provide a very solid starting point for content creation, but with out some sort of standard for them to follow, I fear their efforts will be not "the way of the future". I think companies will want content setup a certain way for the way they perform their daily tasks. I don't know maybe I'm out of touch or inexperienced as I've never worked for a true Architectural firm, but it seems to me that for us to use those windows, there would be some serious time put into setting up the detail levels, what to display in what views, adding all the other parameters that we need to schedule, changing existing schedules to work with different parameter names, getting it to work in a project, etc.... which means if I have to do it too often, I'd just start with another family that I already have and am familiar with and change the numbers to suit my needs and distribute it to other users.