Stud Counts in Schedules

[tc3dcad60731]

Okay, so I know how to take basic stuff like the perimeter and divide by 16 or 24 for stud count to show in schedule. The problem is that most walls will overlap resulting in bloated counts. I can go back to the old method of taking wall lengths and calculating by hand but I want it to show in a schedule and be auto-updated if at all possible.

Guidance please!!!

What is the best way to formulate this or is it better to embed the studs in the standard walls that I use over and over? Further, what about calculating for studs in corners, doubled around doors and windows, etc. (this is where the other vendors do a slightly better job from what I have seen).

Looking for help from those in the know. Thanks in advance.

[patricks]

I'm not sure what the rule of thumb is for calculating stud counts, but it has to be more than just dividing by 16" or 24", because you always have at least 3 studs at a corner, and usually 2 or 3, or sometimes even 4 studs on each side of door and window openings. So even your "bloated" counts from overlapping walls may not give you enough studs to actually build it.

If the rule of thumb is wall length divided by stud spacing plus a certain percentage, that should be easy enough to make a schedule calculate.

[arqt49]

Before buying Revit, I considered Vectorworks.
Vectorworks had a very nice tool for drawing automatic runners and studs from the walls with openings.
Let's just hope someday Revit will get that kind of tool.
Besides that, Revit rules! :lol:

[tc3dcad60731]

Yes, Revit does rule! However, I have to figure a way to calc the studs and the percentage sounds closer for a real count. There are other programs out there that will give you better BOM lists counting studs and even straps, brackets, etc. I have to find away to automate this more.

Thank you both.

[bwagner]

When I was working construction to put myself through engineering school an old carpenter told me the rule of thumb was 1 stud per foot for 16" spacing. It seemed like overkill to me and the anal engineer in me just had to figure out exactly how many we needed. It turned out that his method worked better than mine. In addition to the extras you need at corners you always need extras for stuff like temporary braces, blocking, replacing a damaged saw horse leg, and to write down the crews lunch order. That does not even include the ever increasing percentage of studs that you get that are unusable for almost anything but cutting them down to small cripples.

Brett

[zenomail105021]

I'm with bwagner. I've been using 1' / LF for years and although not perfect it usually works out pretty close. Haven't found anything better.

Bill Maddox
Maddox Builders, Inc.

[tc3dcad60731]

Thank you Brett and Bill

I am trying to see what else I can do for calculating other items also like sq of shingles and possibly return a value for number of roofing nails, caulk etc. It is all one long unending process.

[Steve_Stafford]

...and possibly return a value for number of roofing nails, caulk etc...and the contractor buys a box of five thousand nails, to him the question is one box or two, three...not I need 2,356 nails. This is kind of an "intellectual pursuit" isn't it? 8-)

[mthurnauer]

And on top of that, how critical is the exact material count when labor is the big cost?

[Mike Sealander]

Having looked for ways to get bills of materials out of Revit (or even better, a cut list), I've given up. It's just not Revit's strength. You're better off printing wall elevations and drawing the light framing by hand, and then putting everything in Excel. Revit is not a generalist design program. It's very architecture-specific, and I have a suspicion that ADSK is focussed on providing tools that architecture firms typically need. Residential design-build shops (of which I was once a member) don't quite overlap in needs with the typical architecture firm's needs.

[tc3dcad60731]

and the contractor buys a box of five thousand nails, to him the question is one box or two, three...not I need 2,356 nails. This is kind of an "intellectual pursuit" isn't it? 8-)

That is my feeling...

The contractor that I am trying to work with is using United Design's Construction Suite 2007 which "fully integrates with CADSoft Envisioneer" for a BOM integration into the estimate side. I have discovered that I can take the BOM from Revit and write it out as a txt then import into Excel and save as xls. Then inside of UDA I can import into the estimate. It is not a smooth transition but it does work and they can modify it from there as far as I am concerned.

Yes, Revit is more general architecture and I am using it more for Residential because I like everything that it can do. However, other programs out there reportedly return values for tubes of caulk, rolls of felt, nails, etc. I will see how I can integrate with their set-up but I am not about to buy another program just for these features. Further my feeling is if they have already submitted an estimate / contract to their client then it does not matter for the finer details since they would (I hope) have already accounted for this and deviations in that contract.

[Dimitri Harvalias]

I think we tend to forget that the information that comes out of any of these programs is only as good as the information that goes in. Unless we actually model all this stuff any quantity take off is going to based on some sort of formula anyway.
That's why they call it an estimate right :lol:

[whittendesigns]

If we are talking merely for self education in residential construction, there are many "rules of thumb" for estimating what you are looking for. The 1 stud per lf has been an industry std. for a long time and is very close.

If you are trying to help the builder get an accurate count, forget it. As a builder myself, it is up to ME to get the accuracy, not you (as an architect) Sorry, but no way would I trust what you guys put on a schedule for my bottom line.

Besides, the way you "build" may not be the way I build. Framing is a perfect example. Theres a dozen or more different ways to build an exterior wall. Maybe my method isn't the same as yours. Your schedules are honorable, but not necessary most of the time.

Many of these rules of thumb rely on sf + 5% or 10% waste.


And on top of that, how critical is the exact material count when labor is the big cost?

in new construction, material is the bigger cost. waste is your profits dwindling.


Vectorworks had a very nice tool for drawing automatic runners....

what's a runner? bottom plate?