Scheduling Multi-Story Concrete Columns

[kgodfrey]

I'm trying to figure out what the best way of scheduling multi-story concrete columns is.

Our typical column schedule would have the columns scheduled from left to right, with the column mark at the top, and the grid locations right underneath.

We have the levels scheduled from bottom up (starting with foundation, then supporting 1st, 2nd, etc.). We then fill in the reinforcing information for each column as needed in the schedule (see attached file).

I don't think this type of schedule is possible in RS (that I can figure out). I have played with the graphical column schedule, and tried using linework to make the columns invisible so they can still be tagged, but then I have to add line work on my sheet to create my grid for the schedule. Is it possible to add parameters for reinforcing, calling out a detail, ties, etc. for each column in a graphical column schedule? If not, I would have to add regular text to the schedule for this.

Creating a regular schedule seems to be pretty intensive. I would have to add parameters for size, vert reinf, ties, etc. for each level to place in the column. This wouldn't be so bad, until we have to do a 25 story building! We would end up with a list of parameters a mile long for columns in their properties box.

Does anyone have any suggestions? I would like to avoid using our ACAD schedule and importing to Revit if possible, but right now, this seems like the best option.

Thanks.

Kris

[djn]

We schedule our concrete column in a similar way and haven't yet figured out how to recreate that schedule format in Revit. We are looking at changing our standards, but that is in debate right know. In the mean time we are using the graphic column schedule to validate the model and drafting our concrete column schedule by hand.

[kgodfrey]

We schedule our concrete column in a similar way and haven't yet figured out how to recreate that schedule format in Revit. We are looking at changing our standards, but that is in debate right know. In the mean time we are using the graphic column schedule to validate the model and drafting our concrete column schedule by hand.

When you say by hand, are you creating linework and using text in a drafting view in Revit?

[dhurtubise]

Can you use 2 schedule (graphical AND regular) to show that information?

[kgodfrey]

Can you use 2 schedule (graphical AND regular) to show that information?

I'm assuming you mean to use the graphical for the Mark and Grid Locations, and then regular for the body of the schdule?

I still run into the problem of being able to sort my schedule vertically. We like to show the reinforcing for each level going from bottom-up (mimicking the construction of the column). Is this possible in one schedule?

Can you eleborate a little bit on your suggestion?

Thanks.

[dhurtubise]

You could sort by level (top of level). That way you could have the top level at the top. It wont graphically gives you youre AutoCAD schedule though

Im wondering if placing the schedule on top of each other would do it.

This is where you need to ask yourself why and it is worth it?

[kgodfrey]

You could sort by level (top of level). That way you could have the top level at the top. It wont graphically gives you youre AutoCAD schedule though

Im wondering if placing the schedule on top of each other would do it.

This is where you need to ask yourself why and it is worth it?

Exactly.

I think the schedules in Revit need some work to make them more user friendly.

[djn]

Yes, when I said by hand I ment drafting lines and text. Even if you use two schedules you still run into problems, as you have seen. One of the main problems is that we will call out the column mark C1 on plan, and that defines a column stack at a specific grid, so it has different column sizes are reinf configuration associated with it, and when you try and schedule it the result isn't as clear as if was in Autocad. One option that we are kicking around is changing to way call out the reinf in that it could be type driven then we could associate a specific reinf type for a specif column so as you go up the building it will the reinf callouts will change. Attached is a couple of examples I put together. I would really like to know how other people are scheduling there concrete columns.

[kgodfrey]

Yes, when I said by hand I ment drafting lines and text. Even if you use two schedules you still run into problems, as you have seen. One of the main problems is that we will call out the column mark C1 on plan, and that defines a column stack at a specific grid, so it has different column sizes are reinf configuration associated with it, and when you try and schedule it the result isn't as clear as if was in Autocad. One option that we are kicking around is changing to way call out the reinf in that it could be type driven then we could associate a specific reinf type for a specif column so as you go up the building it will the reinf callouts will change. Attached is a couple of examples I put together. I would really like to know how other people are scheduling there concrete columns.

I am fairly new to schedules so I have a few questions:

1. In the concrete schedule at the top of the screen, how do you get multiple C1 and C2 marks in the schedule? Are you tagging the column more than once? Are you leaving "itemize every instance" checked in your schedule properties?

2. In that same schedule, how are you getting the blank line between each column type?

3. In the concrete column schedule just above the graphical column schedule, how do you get the "double header" (?) for the column ties? You have TIES and then underneath that you have LOC 1 and LOC 2? I've been wondering if you can do that.

Could you post or email me a file with these schedules in it? I'd be interested in taking a look at them.

Thanks.

[djn]

1. In the schedule at the top I have filled out the "Mark" for each column in the column stack. Then I sorted the schedule by "Mark", then "Base Level", and the "Top Level", and I am not itemizing every instance.

2. You can in the formatting tab you can clikc blank line between "Top Level" paramter you are sorting by.

3. In the schedule view if you highlight to columns you will see on the options bar a group button will become available.

The second schedule was created using "schedule keys" were you can create a scheulde with cretain parameters and then assign it different elements. In my experience this is a better way to schedule instance elements instead of using the "mark" parameter like to first schedule I created. What happens is that if some adds a new column the mark and all reinf parameters have to be filled out in order for you to see it in the schedule.

I will post the file as soon as I can I am working on trying to get something out the door.

[djn]

I tried to post the file, but couldn't get it below the 2mb limit. The smallest I could get it is 3mb. If you really want it I can post it to our ftp site.

[djn]

I am curious on which way you decided to schedule you columns, as we are debating with in our office on which method to choose, or whether to just draft the schedule with lines as we also had.

[johk]

We too have one column schedule that show reinforcing etc similar to what Kris posted. What we ended up doing is having 2 schedules similar to what DJN posted.
This is working out pretty good so fare. I have noticed you can't take the Autocad standards and apply it to how you work in Revit. It will way to time consuming :)
I have been reading through the forum but I was wondering if it is possible to NOT show the Level height in schedule and also to Not show the column locations? Are there any way you can turn them off?

Cheers,
Jonas

[Paul Andersen]

I have been reading through the forum but I was wondering if it is possible to NOT show the Level height in schedule and also to Not show the column locations?

In short there is no easy way that I am aware of to accomplish either of these. Some less than ideal techniques that may get you close are listed below.

Column Locations

View Properties -> Text Appearance -> Column Location: Set the font height to 1/256".
View Properties -> Grid Appearance -> Below Bottom Level: Set the height to 1/256".

This basically results in a thickened line at the bottom of the schedule and most printers will show any text that falls outside the lines as a dot if at all. You can further hide the "micro-text" by overriding (thickening) the lineweight of the grid. VV -> Model Categories Tab -> Lines -> Thin Lines.

Levels

Similar to the Column Locations technique above.

View Properties -> Text Appearance -> Level Text: Set the font height to 1/256".
View Properties -> Grid Appearance -> For Level Names: Set the width to 1/256".

This effectively gets rid of the Level Names (depending on the length of the name). Assuming you want the Level Names just not the Height this approach would require adding linework and text to the schedule on the sheet view.

You can also create an adjustable white filled region with invisible line boundaries as a generic annotation to place on the sheet view as a "white out" symbol over the Level Height text. This typically requires some maintenance throughout the duration of the project due to changes in Level Heights or overall size (number of columns) being scheduled.

Another thought would be to edit a font essentially turning the #'s, -, ', and " to blank or space characters. You could then set the View Properties -> Text Appearance -> Level Text: to this font. Aside from all of the typical baggage associated with a modified font you would also not be able to use the blanked out characters as part of your level name which may also be problematic.

Hey, I said these were less than ideal :lol:.

[johk]

Thanks,
I ended up suing a combination of "minimize the column locations and using a white out symbol the level heights.
I think that should be an option to what you want to see in the column schedule. Being a structural draftee we never put any heights to Levels etc..
It would be good if you could display the concrete columns as a line rather then a "box".
For some reason - every time I try to plot the drawing with the column schedule on it - Revit crashes???? Anyone know what could casue it?
Thanks
Jonas