controling the angle of curtain grid

[sami]

I’m creating a curtain system from a massing (solid blend) so my walls are tilted at different angles, how can I control the angle of my vertical mullions?
When I add mullions or curtain grid the angle is preset based on my mass, is there any way to sketch mullions or curtain grids in any angle just like I can sketch a line on a wall?

[sjsl]

Currently there is no way to sketch mullion lines. You can set the angle of the mullions but only one angle per grid.

Select mullion from Design Bar, go to Properties and then to Type Parameters first line says Angle.

[jj mac]

Further to the previous response, you can only have one angle per grid direction. For example, if you set the angle for the vertical grids all vertical grids will be placed on that angle.

From my experience, individual grids within the system cannot have independent angles... however, they should.

You may need to breakup your curtain system / wall into induvidual sections.

[SupremeTaco]

Imagine trying to model THIS in Revit... This is exactly why we need to be able to draw individual mullion angles.
Also notice how this system is made up of 6 different (including the sides) planes... Impossible from what i know in Revit!

[Scott Womack]

Imagine trying to model THIS in Revit... This is exactly why we need to be able to draw individual mullion angles.
Also notice how this system is made up of 6 different (including the sides) planes... Impossible from what i know in Revit!


Not impossible, merely difficult. You'd have to use multiple curtainwalls, along that plane, it appears that 5 would be needed, one each where the supports penetrate, and then one on each end, and one between supports. You edit the profile of all five, using the tilt in-wards to wards penetrations and the "slanted" curtainwall grids.

[twiceroadsfool]

As Scott said. Or, you facet the sketch of the mass at the top and bottom, where those slanted mullions should meet. Doing so should create a break in the blend, making different *faces* for the curtain walls to be applied.

i think it owuld be rather fun to try. :)

BTW, id also love to know the design intent between the varying angles and their locations, or if its just random...

[SupremeTaco]

Scott,

I'm not sure how that would work with only 5 of them. The "front" of the glazing system consists of 4 different planes. The two lower ones are vertical, and the upper ones lean outward while following the angles that the lower ones set. I think what Aaron suggested for creating it by face would be appropriate, but then you have the issue of the mullions all going in random directions.

As for the design intent, Aaron, I'm not 100% sure. Our architect (www.hplusf.com) sure designed one hell of a unique structure... it's been very fun building it. This building has many features to resemble the surrounding oak trees this city has, and the whole lobby area (with the branching columns) gives the feel of being up in the trees, with steel branches all around. You should see what the inside of the theater looks like :p makes the glazing system look simple.

Edit: Sorry for hijacking the thread, but their answers to this situation could probably help your situation as well!

[Scott Womack]

I was thinking only in the upper section tilting out. After looking again, you'd need a similar number in the lower section. Aaron's methods work, but I'm not sure you have as much control over the Curtainwall System, as you do over a Curtainwall drawn as a wall. He may disagree. Point is, Revit can do it, just not in a straight-forward manner.

[mthurnauer]

On Supreme Taco's design, It seems that you consistently have horizontal mullions, but the verticals are on an anlge. I would just make the curtainwall system only have the horizontals and perimeter mullions and then I would make the angled ones as an in-place family sweeping the typical mullion profile on lines drawn at the appropriate angle

[SupremeTaco]

On Supreme Taco's design, It seems that you consistently have horizontal mullions, but the verticals are on an anlge. I would just make the curtainwall system only have the horizontals and perimeter mullions and then I would make the angled ones as an in-place family sweeping the typical mullion profile on lines drawn at the appropriate angle

Hmm... that's a really good idea. Probably the most simple one yet! I'm thinking make the walls by face and then only having it do horizontals and doing what you suggested.

I'll be playing with everybody's ideas and let you guys know eventually :)

[twiceroadsfool]

Here, i did a quick one with the method i was discussing.

total time invested so far = 5 minutes.

Obviously my mullions arent right, becuase i was just looking at the photo and splitting the lines randomly. All you have to know is where the mullions are located at the bottom of the shapes, and at the top. use the split command on the sketch lines of a blend (dont use an extrusion), then curtain system by face and youre all set.

The ones on the side of the building i would use a curtain WAl and rotate the mullion pattern, since it looks like a regular orthagonal grid rotated.

Id go with this or Scotts suggestion of editing the profile of actual curtain walls. Id personally shy away from in place families, as itll be more work, plus then things like your curtain panels wont reflect accurate counts if you schedule them... (As multiple panels will be combined...).

That, and in place families are the devil, in my very humble opinion. :)

[sami]

Select mullion from Design Bar, go to Properties and then to Type Parameters first line says Angle.
this only changes the angle of the mullion in "section" though not in "elevation" what I've concluded is that you can't place a mullion until you have a curtain grid, and as far as I can see there is no way to control the angle of individual curtain grids.

also it seems you can set the angle for a curtain wall for all the grids on that wall, but you can't do that for a curtain system (which is what I am using in my example since it is a complex massing that doesn’t accept curtain walls)

[twiceroadsfool]

Sami-

Thats why i would only use that method for the ones on the sides. In those areas, the shape (appears to be) is a regular vertical wall with an edited profile, and the mullion grid turned. So a Curtain WALL with an edited profile and the angle parameter should suffice. The curtain systems worked out fine in the example file. Open it up and play around with the sketch lines. :)

[sami]

..The curtain systems worked out fine in the example file. Open it up and play around with the sketch lines. :)

thanks Aaron this method is very interesting, I'm working on a small competition and I'm tempted to change the design just to experiment with your technique..

since we''re at this how would someone model a building like this.
http://www.worldarchitecturenews.com/index.php?fuseaction=wanappln.projectview&upload_id=11076

the first question is how do you mass it? I dont think a solid blend would do it alone, right?

[twiceroadsfool]

Several solid blends... As the sketches have to be in the plane of the mullions, youd need a few, but IF i was hell bent on modeling the entire thing in Revit, thats what i would do...

[SupremeTaco]

Here, i did a quick one with the method i was discussing.

total time invested so far = 5 minutes.

Damn you're good... I wish I had my Revit skills up to par with yours! Thanks again as usual haha... You're doing a good job at impressing my boss, you really might get yourself an invite to Cali soon!

[twiceroadsfool]

Please do! I had to shovel 6 inches of fresh white off my driveway last night, and just walked to lunch in 16 degree weather, LOL.

Besides, i learned it here on AUGI... :)

[vmalerbajr]

May I please add an additonal question to this thread....

I understand how the angles are controlled but what about the direction of grid line 1 and grid line 2.....if we make a custom curtain grid system can we specify which is grid 1 and grid 2......see screen shot attached...
we need to have grid line 2 be the major grid and run the long way down our roof structure....the first roof structure is built is the larger one with openings. the smaller roof structure has yet to be penetrated with openings.....

we tried the order of drawing the extruded mass lines...same thing...
the only solution was to copy the mass from the correct system and edit that mass to get the second roof the way we would like it.
i just think there has to be a way to controll the way the curtain system gets created when we select the face of a mass.

thanks all for the help!

[doe]

May I please add an additonal question to this thread....

I understand how the angles are controlled but what about the direction of grid line 1 and grid line 2.....if we make a custom curtain grid system can we specify which is grid 1 and grid 2......see screen shot attached...
we need to have grid line 2 be the major grid and run the long way down our roof structure....the first roof structure is built is the larger one with openings. the smaller roof structure has yet to be penetrated with openings.....

we tried the order of drawing the extruded mass lines...same thing...
the only solution was to copy the mass from the correct system and edit that mass to get the second roof the way we would like it.
i just think there has to be a way to controll the way the curtain system gets created when we select the face of a mass.

thanks all for the help!

Good question, has anyone really addressed this issue? I can't seem to find much info elsewhere on this. How does revit, or a user for that matter, specify Grid 1 vs Grid 2 on a mass?? can it be changed without having to create a second version of the same grid?

[doe]

bump... would love to know the answer about curtain system panels and figuring out Grid 1 vs Grid 2 and if it can be controlled or changed once the system is made.

thanks