Data References create Style Errors

[WScottAllenPE]

I have one drawing containing my pipe networks. The parts list and part styles were dragged in from my template drawing. So, I can swap a part to a five foot manhole with a five-foot manhole style. The structure property will show a 60" diameter MH with the style MH-5, and a 60" diameter MH block will be inserted on the plan and profile. Everything just as I want and expect.

In my plan and profiles, I data referenced the pipe networks in to add them to the profiles. As in the pipe network drawing, the parts list and part styles were dragged in from my template drawing, so they are identical. The structure properties will correctly show a 60" diameter MH, but the style has been assigned as MH-4, and it will insert a 48" diameter MH block.

This is just an example, and it happens with all types of structures. I can manually change it to the correct style and it is OK. But it won't come in the correct way to start with.

What I have found is that, in my parts list, the MH-4 and MH-5 are in the same catalog (Round Manholes). Whenever the network includes any part from this catalog set (Round Manholes), it will always revert to the first style in the list (MH-4). The same problem exists with catalog Square Inlet, Round Inlet, Water Valves, etc. Any part in a category will have the correct property size, but will always be assigned the style of the first part in the list.

Any body know how to fix?

I'm using Civil 3D 2011 on XP.

Thanks

Scott

[civil3Dguide]

Questions:
Is the MH-4 the default style to be used in?
And, if so, if you change the default style to be used first does it then use the correct style?

[WScottAllenPE]

Christian,

No, my default style is set to Standard for everything. I double checked.

Like I said in the last paragraph, it is not always the MH-4 style, but it is the style of the first part in each catalog.

MH-4 style for all Round Manholes
Inlet-2x3 for Square Inlet
Inlet-24Inch for Round Inlet
WV-1Inch for Water Valves, etc.

Scott

[MattAnderson]

Scott -

That vaguely sounds familiar... Could you open an Autodesk Support request with the details so that Support & QA can take a look?

Matthew Anderson, PE

[WScottAllenPE]

Matt,

I'll go through my IT to do so.

BUT - Latest update. My pipes also appear to be doing something similar. My pipe network in my pipe drawing has a 12" pipe, as per Pipe Properties. In my data referenced drawing, the pipe is listed as a 30" pipe.

I'll post when I find out something.

Scott

[smcgypsea]

any resolutions to this?

[WScottAllenPE]

No resolution.

I did open a support request through Autodesk. They asked for the drawings and I've sent the drawings three times now. At first, thought they were ignoring it since 2012 was out and we were on 2011.

However, we have since switched to 2012, and I have the same problem. Autodesk was told this and was sent the drawings again in 2012 format, but I have received no response. I had to put this project on the back burner without an answer, but I'll have to get back to it soon, and figure something out.

Does your request mean that you have the same problem? Because my history seems to be for problems that no one else has or are rare enough that no one else seems to have, and are too difficult to give good answers to. It's always nice to know it I'm alone in my problem or not (it makes me know what level of insanity I'm currently living at).

Scott

[WScottAllenPE]

I know the cause everybody! Now I just need help with a workflow to fix this problem.

Let's say you are working in your Pipes.dwg. You need a new structure "STR M" that is a 39.37 inch manhole. So what do you do? You open your Pipe Network Parts List and add a new structure "Structure - Manhole - Meter" under components "Manholes". That new structure doesn't have a style, so you create a new style "Style - Manhole - Meter". You insert your manhole, it looks good, and you save your drawing.

Next, you want to insert your new structure in your Profile.dwg. So what do you do? You open the Profile.dwg, right? Well, C3D at this point says:

"Hey, this STR M is a new manhole. It is supposed to be a Structure-Manhole-Meter with a style of Style-Manhole-Meter. But wait, I can't find that structure in my parts list or as a structure style. So, I guess I'll just assign STR-M the first style I have under the components Manholes, which is MH-4. That'll make my Engineer happy!"

Well Civil 3D, you did not make me happy. For a structure, yes, I can import the parts list and new style from the other drawing, select STR M, and manually change the style under the Structure Properties. (Although it is very inconvenient, especially if you have added a few dozen new structures consisting of several different styles.)

But I am even more unhappy when it comes to pipes. Say that you created a Pipe - Meter instead of a Manhole - Meter. Well, C3D does the same thing, and assigns it the first style it finds as a replacement. However, you don't have the option to select the pipe and change its style in order to change the size of the pipe. So, your STR M (a 39.37 inch pipe) was just assigned the style of a 12 inch pipe, displays as a 12 inch pipe, says it is a 39.37 inch pipe, and CANNOT BE CHANGED. No, C3D, that makes me very unhappy.

Now, I have two work arounds, presuming you remember all of this when you have this issue.

The first if to open Profile.dwg BEFORE you add your new structure, part, and style in the Pipes.dwg. Then you can save the Pipes.dwg, and import the parts list and style into the Profile.dwg. Then, and only then, are you safe to syncronize the pipe network or to re-open the Profile.dwg.

The second work around is to rename Pipes.dwg (to for example PipeTemp.dwg). Then, when you open the Profile.dwg, it cannot find Pipes.dwg to bring in the new structures. This gives you the opportunity to bring in the style and parts list and save Profile.dwg. Then you can rename PipeTemp.dwg and reopen Profile.dwg to establish your new structures.

But, if you have more than just Profile.dwg that you've got the pipe network in, you have to do it for each drawing. Now that is inconvenient (since I have 25 plan and profile drawings with the pipe network data referenced).

So, basically, the problem is that by opening the file in order to bring in your new styles for your new part, you have to bring in your new parts first which gives them the wrong style.

So, does anyone have any suggestions for a good workflow to deal with this issue?

Thanks,
Scott

[mjfarrell]

Have you looked at the settings for XML Parts Swapping swapping rules under the settings tab?

I'm not sure if this is going to totally resolve your issue, or have any impact at all...however it could.
As the data reference IS technically importing the pipes via XML; even if that isn't the command in use.

[WScottAllenPE]

Are you referring to the settings under "Pipe Network", "Storm Sewer Migration Defaults" ("Part Matching Defaults", etc)?

If so, after looking through the help files for that setion, it appears that these settings are reserved for the commands to transfer the Civil 3D data to and from the Storm and Sanitary Analysis (.stm files). Since my problem is related to C3D to C3D instead, do these settings apply?

If they do apply, I still have the problem of having to open the drawings to make the changes to the settings to bring in the data correctly, but by opening the drawing, the data automatically comes in incorrectly. I still create the problem in trying to fix the problem.