Enabling Lisp in AutoCAD LT

[jsr13]

I have one seat of AutoCAD LT 2005 that is used seldom enough that it is definitely not worth the cost to upgrade to a full AutoCAD license (upgrade quoted at $2000+), but without lisp functionality she can't use the majority of our custom routines.

I've done some research & come up with two software add-ons that will (supposedly) add the functionality I need:

LT Extender 2000 Plus ($149 per license)
LT Toolkit Max ($450 per license)

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My questions to the forum are these:

Does anyone know of other quality programs that "unlock" lisp in LT?

Has anyone used either of these programs or know anyone who has?

What kind of results did you/they get?

Are either of them "install & forget" or does the end user (with no lisp knowledge) have to modify what they do to get them to work correctly?

If you are familiar with both of these: in your opinion is it worth paying 3 times the cost for the Toolkit Max? I'm wondering if the cost difference is a sign of quality difference between the two, or if it just simply means that one is more expensive.

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ANY & ALL comments/suggestions are appreciated - positive or negative!
Hopefully this will benefit a number of people out there.

Thanks to everyone in advance!

[de-co1]

Thank you for posting that. I have personally never heard of LT add ons that allow lisp. This is definitely something I'm going to look into for this company, as I too, miss my lisp routines...

[jsr13]

I just recently heard that there are a couple of them out there & the cost is MUCH less than a full upgrade. We just need for a few people with experience with them to actually post here! I don't know if those programs are worthless or are worth their weight in gold, ya' know?
I feel your pain - I would be totally lost without my lisp routines.
You should consider hari-kari if they won't at least consider getting you one of these.

[tyshofner]

I have LT-Extender loaded on all our LT machines. It works fairly well and can use MOST lisp routines. I say most routines because it does have some issues with VLISP functions (vl-, vlr-, vlax-, etc.). But they are constantly upgrading and adding new functions. But it works for the most part. My only other complaint is that it is not quite as stable as the full version (sometimes, rarely, routines don't get loaded), but other than that it is a great tool. I would recommend it to anyone who has LT and can't live without their lisp routines. Also, not only does it open up LISP but quite a few other useful commands (xclip, imagemanger, 3D commands) just to name a few. Any other questions just let me know.

Ty

[Augi Doggie]

We tried out a 30 day trial of LT extender and it worked surprisingly well. For the record, there are quite a few of these programs out there.

I will make a big point to mention that Autodesk may not continue to offer you Support and/or void your subscription if they know that you are using these programs. Some of them do alter your LT files.

Please research before you try out or purchase any of these programs! Friendly warning.

[jsr13]

But they are constantly upgrading and adding new functions. But it works for the most part. My only other complaint is that it is not quite as stable as the full version (sometimes, rarely, routines don't get loaded), but other than that it is a great tool.

Thanks for the reply. Can you clarify a couple of things for me/us?

"Not quite as stable as the full version..." Are you saying that the combination of AutoCAD LT + LT Extender isn't as stable as the full version of AutoCAD or that the version you have (of LT Extender) isn't as stable as the full version of the program? Is there more than one version? The website for LT Extender shows only one (version 1.9), but maybe you know something else??? I know from the LT Toolkit website that there is more than one version of that program (LT Toolkit & LT Toolkit Max).

Also, as far as upgrades, do you get upgrades free when they come out? Is it a minor upgrades free but you have to pay for major releases kind of setup?

[jsr13]

We tried out a 30 day trial of LT extender and it worked surprisingly well. For the record, there are quite a few of these programs out there.

I will make a big point to mention that Autodesk may not continue to offer you Support and/or void your subscription if they know that you are using these programs. Some of them do alter your LT files.

Please research before you try out or purchase any of these programs! Friendly warning.

Very good point about the (possible) void of support & subscription! I don't have to worry about the subscription, but many others do. Excellent point to keep in mind.

All the research I did only came up with these two programs. Do you have the names of some others? The guys in the local users group only knew of "the German one that Autodesk is trying to sue" was how one of them put it - that would be LT Extender.

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Question for both kleary & tyshofner:
Take your most cad-illiterate user: is there anything he/she has to do differently than they would if they were using full AutoCAD? We always need to look at the "weakest link" factor.

[Augi Doggie]

Even our weakest link runs into problems that show the shortcomings compared to the full version. I'm not downing LT, it servers it's purpose and is not free from the "you get what you pay for" maxim.

Inserting Images is the top one by far. You can manipulate them if they are already in the drawing but not insert them.
Number two would be publishing, you can only publish a multiple DWF, you can not publish to a plotter.

I hope both of those change in future releases.

[jsr13]

How about in getting lisp/arx to run? Once it is set up (by me), is there anything that the "weakest link" user has to do for lisp/arx routines to run? Will the lisp routines that run fine with full AutoCAD work the same way (without modification) with the AutoCAD LT + LT Extender combination?

[tyshofner]

When I said "not quite as stable as I would like" I was speaking of the LISP environment. I have noticed no stability issues related to ACLT when Extender is loaded just the Extender LISP environment. Sometimes routines won't get loaded automatically, reactors won't fire all the time (this would be one of my biggest complaints), and some VLISP commands won't function. But other than that it works very well. As far as the not loading routines all the time I simply made a button for my LT users that will load the routines for them.

Also, as far as legal issues go here is what I know (not saying it's fact but through my research I believe this to be correct). In LT releases from 2002 and down (2000i, 2000, etc.) Autodesk had actually left the core LISP processor and even some "Full ACAD" commands in the LT install package, they just made them inaccessible. LT Extender would then open up those functions for your use. This is when Autodesk slapped a lawsuit on them. Now from release 2004 and up Autodesk has completely removed those components from the LT install package. This forced Extender to write their own LISP processing engine as well as routines for the commands. This is why in the new releases of Extender not quite all the LISP functions work (mostly VLISP functions) correctly. Having done this I believe that Extender is now "legal". I know for sure that the LISP engines are different because I've had to adjust code (that worked fine in FULL ACAD) to make it work with Extender. But as I said take this with a grain of salt, because this is just what I have learned from my own research into the subject of being "legal".

Ty