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Thread: structural members

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    Certifiable AUGI Addict dzatto's Avatar
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    Default structural members

    I've got a w16X26 beam and I'm trying to add stiffeners to it. I read how to add blocks in the help file, sounds easy.
    Problem is, no matter how I draw the block, when I add it to the structural member style, it is always turned the wrong way. The beam is 5.5" wide, and it is 15" from flange to flange (tall) and the stiffener is a 1/2" plate. When the block is attached, it is shown as 15" wide and 5.5" tall. So I rotate the block and re-create it. Now it is rotated parallel to the beam instead of perpendicular. No matter what I do, it won't come out correct. Also, sometimes when I attach the block to a specific member style, it attaches the block to every member style in the entire drawing. I have to undo it all and start over. Why is it attaching it to every member style?

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    Certifiable AUGI Addict dzatto's Avatar
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    Default Re: structural members

    well, I finally got it to work, but it made no sense at all. If anyone has a better way, please let me know. My UCS is standard x and y in plan view, but when I needed to offset the block in the positive x direction, I had to enter a negative y value! Something is messed up, but it works, so.................

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    Super Moderator dkoch's Avatar
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    Default Re: structural members

    Quote Originally Posted by dzatto
    I've got a w16X26 beam and I'm trying to add stiffeners to it. I read how to add blocks in the help file, sounds easy.
    Problem is, no matter how I draw the block, when I add it to the structural member style, it is always turned the wrong way. The beam is 5.5" wide, and it is 15" from flange to flange (tall) and the stiffener is a 1/2" plate. When the block is attached, it is shown as 15" wide and 5.5" tall. So I rotate the block and re-create it. Now it is rotated parallel to the beam instead of perpendicular. No matter what I do, it won't come out correct. Also, sometimes when I attach the block to a specific member style, it attaches the block to every member style in the entire drawing. I have to undo it all and start over. Why is it attaching it to every member style?
    I can not claim to understand all of the nuances of structural members, as I rarely need more than those created by the wizard. But if I recall, because structural members can be oriented vertically (columns), horizontally (beams/girders) or at an angle (braces), the XYZ coordinate system used to define the members is not the World Coordinate System, but is an Object Coordinate System. I believe that the X axis is along the length of the member. You are on your own for which directions are Y and Z. I would guess that Y is the member depth ("d"), parallel to the web of a W-shape, and Z is the member width ("bf"), parallel to the flanges of a W-shape, but I could be wrong about that.

    As for your custom blocks showning on all styles, that sounds like you are editing the drawing default display settings, rather than setting a style-level override and editing that, so that the display changes only affect structural members of that style. When editing the member style display settings, be certain that, for the desired Display Representation, there is a checkmark in the toggle in the right column, and the source indicates that it is a style override, not drawing default.

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    Certifiable AUGI Addict dzatto's Avatar
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    Default Re: structural members

    Quote Originally Posted by dkoch
    I can not claim to understand all of the nuances of structural members, as I rarely need more than those created by the wizard. But if I recall, because structural members can be oriented vertically (columns), horizontally (beams/girders) or at an angle (braces), the XYZ coordinate system used to define the members is not the World Coordinate System, but is an Object Coordinate System. I believe that the X axis is along the length of the member. You are on your own for which directions are Y and Z. I would guess that Y is the member depth ("d"), parallel to the web of a W-shape, and Z is the member width ("bf"), parallel to the flanges of a W-shape, but I could be wrong about that.

    As for your custom blocks showning on all styles, that sounds like you are editing the drawing default display settings, rather than setting a style-level override and editing that, so that the display changes only affect structural members of that style. When editing the member style display settings, be certain that, for the desired Display Representation, there is a checkmark in the toggle in the right column, and the source indicates that it is a style override, not drawing default.
    Thanks for the info, that makes total sense about the XYZ coordinates. It was driving me nuts!!!
    As far as the block on all styles, the display style has always been checked by default once I edit it, making it an override. I don't physically check it, it always just happened, so that could have been the problem. I'll keep an eye out for that in the future.

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    Super Moderator david_peterson's Avatar
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    Default Re: structural members

    Here's what I remember about Beam Styles. The X & Y coords actually define the beam shape, and "Z" is the length. It's this way because they were based on the column style. Or I've got it backwords and David K is correct.

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    100 Club cholmes's Avatar
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    Default Re: structural members

    X is along the length of the member, no matter if it is a column or beam.
    Y is the width, and Z is the depth.

    Just picture a wide flange beam being drawn in plan view, without any roll. The path you are drawing it at is the X value. The Y value is perpendicular to that path (which would be the width), and the Z direction is coming up towards you (which would be the depth).

    Hopefully this helps clear it up some. As I was writing this, I realized how hard it actually is to describe!

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    Super Moderator david_peterson's Avatar
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    Default Re: structural members

    Thanks for the clarification Chris

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