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Thread: Property Set, List and Classification Definitions

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    Question Property Set, List and Classification Definitions

    Hey all. Running ACA 2009.
    I'm looking to see if anyone has any links, pdf's, and/or tutorials on the above subjects. The only hits I'm really finding are specific questions relating to a problem. I'm looking for a broad brush (for lack of a better term) of these subjects. The help files that come with ACA are...lets just say...f%#*ing awful. Thats being kind. I'm looking for clarification on how they all work together and real world examples. I'm having a difficult time understanding how they all fit together and when/where/how to use them.

    I am in the middle of adding additional information to our styles to have on our company palettes. I have successfully been able to add formula properties to a manufacturers window style to calculate light, vent, area, rough opening, etc...all based off the variable window size. This works great with a double hung window. Where I'm having issue is with windows that are operable or fixed, left/right handing, etc... I want to be able to have the operator select if the window is fixed, left, right, etc... I know I can accomplish this using list definitions, but they are not able to be edited when inserted into the drawing and can I create a formula that says "if the window is fixed, then vent area is 0"? I may have several types of each window in a drawing and I would like to stick with one window style. I also want to know how classifications fit into this, if at all. I eventually want to incorporate all my window types and doors with this method and eventually...eventually create automatic light/vent and energy schedules. I know that's a lot, but I started this ball rolling and I'm real excited to get some cool results. Any insight or help is greatly appreciated.

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    Super Moderator dkoch's Avatar
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    Default Re: Property Set, List and Classification Definitions

    See my reply here: http://discussion.autodesk.com/forum...hreadID=703243

    I can post the proper blog post link here, at least, as well as attach the Brain Dump files.

    http://architects-desktop.blogspot.c...resources.html
    Attached Files Attached Files

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    Default Re: Property Set, List and Classification Definitions

    I learned it the old fashioned way: Just dive in head first and really screw it up. Nothing teaches as much as a huge mistake.

    That being said, I just went into the property data definitions and poked around until I figured out what everything was, at least those things that I needed or could use.

    The classifications are separate from property sets. In essence, the classifications are filters, when used properly. I have had to add several classifications to the OOTB Uniformat II, though. For example, I had to create new classifications for toilet stall walls and doors to prevent them from being counted in schedules.

    I scanned over the papers suggested by dkoch, and they should keep you from making the big mistakes I made.

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    Default Re: Property Set, List and Classification Definitions

    Thanks to the both of you for your quick replies and information. Every bit helps.

    David,

    I have looked up the resources you mentioned (I forgot all about the Brain Dumps! I had them sitting on my server!). I Didn't know about that blog post, I'll bookmark it. Funny too because I read your blog frequently, thanks for what you do. Looks like tons of useful information on it. I'm reading ATP071 right now, so I'm sure I'll have specifics once I really drill down into it.

    Thanks again guys! Happy Friday!

    Chad

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    Default Re: Property Set, List and Classification Definitions

    One thing of note that I'm having immediate issue with is List Definitions.

    I have a window style that I want the user to be able to select if it is left, right, or fixed. I created a List Definition called "Handing" which contains Left, Right, Fixed for options. Now, I add a manual Property Definition called "Handing" to my custom PSD. I set the "Type" to "List" and the "Source" to "Handing", set my default to Left and make it visible. I close out of the SM and check my extended properties of the window that has my custom PSD attached to it. Its shows all the correct information, but I can not edit the manual property, it shows the default (left) greyed out. Why can't I edit it? There will be many times where I will have several of the exact same style window, but they will all have different handing. Do I have to create three different window styles? I hope not! Any thoughts? Thanks for any insight.

    Chad

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    Super Moderator dkoch's Avatar
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    Default Re: Property Set, List and Classification Definitions

    It works for me here at the office in 2008. See the drawing in the attached ZIP file. Does this file allow you to change the handing?
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    Default Re: Property Set, List and Classification Definitions

    I got it, finally. I looked through your style and it is very similar to mine. One thing I never did was to detach and reattach the PSD to the window style. I think I was attaching the PSD wrong in the first place. I was doing through edit wall style dialog and not through the properties window. What is the difference between the two anyway?
    Now, why doesn't the extended data come through on the tool palettes? If I add a window into a new drawing via the palette, shouldn't the extended data carry over via the palette?

    Thanks again for taking the time to help me out on this. I do appreciate it.

    Chad

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    Super Moderator dkoch's Avatar
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    Default Re: Property Set, List and Classification Definitions

    If you create a style-based Property Set Definition (radio buttons at the top of the Applies To tab when editing the Property Set Definition), you have to attach it on the General Tab of a Style of an object type to which the Property Set Definition applies. You set any manual values after attaching the style-based Property Set here as well, and the Property Set becomes part of the style and the properties/values travel with it. These will be visible on the Properties Palette, but not directly editable there (unless you are using 2004). As I mentioned in my reply in the Autodesk Discussion Groups, in more recent versions, there is a worksheet icon on the header line that will allow you to edit the values attached at the style level. Keep in mind this will change the values for all objects using that style.

    An object-based Property Set has to be attached to each instance of the object; it is not automatically attached when you place the object. You can add it manually, using the Extended Data tab of the Properties palette, if the Property Set Definition you want to attach is already in the drawing. If not, you can either use Style Manager to copy the Property Set Definition into the drawing, or set up a Tag tool, which will add needed Property Sets from a source file when you tag the object. If you do not need a Schedule Tag on your object, you can set up a Tag tool that only adds the Property Sets, without adding a Schedule Tag: http://architects-desktop.blogspot.c...set-tools.html

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    Default Re: Property Set, List and Classification Definitions

    David,

    Again, I can't thank you enough. That is exactly what I'm looking for. Sometimes all you need is a simple, human, real world explanation of the process. Something that Autodesk consistently fails at. These menus, options and settings can be drilled down so deep in ACA, its sometimes hard to come up for a breath. Thanks again!

    Chad

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